Item
Liz Haynes, Oral History, 2021/04/21
Media
Title (Dublin Core)
Liz Haynes, Oral History, 2021/04/21
Description (Dublin Core)
Liz Haynes discusses her life pre-COVID and how she has been affected during COVID as a cancer survivor. She talks about her love of travel and hopefully future plans, politics (local and federal), and ends with positive outlook for the future.
Recording Date (Dublin Core)
Creator (Dublin Core)
Partner (Dublin Core)
Controlled Vocabulary (Dublin Core)
English
Government Federal
English
Government State
English
Healthcare
English
Public Health & Hospitals
English
Travel
English
Social Distance
Curator's Tags (Omeka Classic)
Collection (Dublin Core)
Collecting Institution (Bibliographic Ontology)
University of Wisconsin Eau Claire
Curatorial Notes (Dublin Core)
Date Submitted (Dublin Core)
12/06/2021
Date Modified (Dublin Core)
04/20/2022
04/22/2022
06/03/2022
03/08/2023
06/21/2023
06/26/2023
Date Created (Dublin Core)
04/27/2021
Interviewer (Bibliographic Ontology)
Nathaniel Langner
Interviewee (Bibliographic Ontology)
Liz Haynes
Location (Omeka Classic)
55109
Little Canada
Minnesota
United States of America
Format (Dublin Core)
Video
Language (Dublin Core)
English
Duration (Omeka Classic)
00:54:08
abstract (Bibliographic Ontology)
Liz Haynes discusses her life pre-COVID and how she has been affected during COVID as a cancer survivor. She talks about her love of travel and hopefully future plans, politics (local and federal), and ends with positive outlook for the future.
Transcription (Omeka Classic)
Nathaniel Langner 00:00
This is an interview with Liz Haynes she is located in Little Canada, Minnesota, I am interviewing her from Eau Claire, Wisconsin, it is 1:38 of April 21 of 2021. Currently, there are 141 million COVID cases in the world with 3 million deaths. In the United States, there have been 31.8 million with 568 deaths, er, 568,000 deaths. In the state of Wisconsin, there has been 65,300 cases with 7,427 deaths resulting. Okay, so I'll start you with some simple questions. And we'll just talk about those and kind of learn about your experiences with COVID. And how your life has changed. So could you just start by listing kind of like your ethnicity, your race and your age?
Liz Haynes 00:59
My mother's family was German. And my father's and and and Dutch, and my father's family was German and Irish. Oh, and English. Excuse me.
Nathaniel Langner 01:11
Okay, thank you very much.
Liz Haynes 01:14
White.
Nathaniel Langner 01:15
Do you have a job at the moment? Or what is your day to day life consists of?
Liz Haynes 01:19
I am retired.
Nathaniel Langner 01:22
How long have you been retired for?
Liz Haynes 01:24
It was as of April 1, it was 11 years.
Nathaniel Langner 01:28
So you're working? No jobs at the time of when COVID started?
Liz Haynes 01:32
No, I was not.
Nathaniel Langner 01:34
Okay. And as we stayed you live in Little Canada, correct?
Liz Haynes 01:38
Yes, sir.
Nathaniel Langner 01:39
Okay, and what's life in like Locanda, like, currently? Or what was it like pre COVID If you just want to summarize, like, kind of like simple day to day life back before COVID,
Liz Haynes 01:50
Pre-COVID, both Bob and I are retired. So I was able to go to the community center. If I wanted to, we could go shopping, we did a great deal of traveling. And traveling has stopped completely. We're lucky we've been able to do kind of whatever we want for the last decade, pre-COVID.
Nathaniel Langner 02:12
So I think I'm talking about the travel would be a really important section coming up. But focusing just on like the community center right now.
Liz Haynes 02:19
Yes
Nathaniel Langner 02:20
How has that changed? Like, can you go to the community center anymore? Are there shorter class sizes? Or have you just decide to refrain from doing anything?
Liz Haynes 02:27
No, I, I have decided to refrain for any of those reasons, I have decided to refrain because I had rotator cuff surgery about eight weeks ago. And before that, I was recovering from a rare form of cancer. So they that that kind of kept me out of the loop for a while.
Nathaniel Langner 02:51
Okay, and then building off of that.
Liz Haynes 02:53
Yes.
Nathaniel Langner 02:53
So when were you diagnosed with cancer? Was that pre COVID? Or was it during COVID?
Liz Haynes 02:58
It was just before COVID I had surgery to remove, lipoma from my leg, February 7 of 2020. And I was diagnosed with spiral sarcoma, February 13 of 2020. So just before the shutdown,
Nathaniel Langner 03:19
okay, so pre shutdown, what was your experience like at the hospital and your support system where people are able to come and support you there? And how did that change after
Liz Haynes 03:30
They could have come if I needed to, but but the surgery was to remove the lipoma was simple. The diagnosis, Bob came with me to the U. And coincidentally, the U has a sarcoma clinic. And because it's fairly rare, it's unique to the U to have this, this clinic. So we were able to go to my appointments together to get the gist of treatments and what they would do, I started radiation treating this because this treatment for this cancer was 25 days of radiation. And I started those, those those, those [unknown word] 2020, which coincidentally was two days after my 70th birthday. So you know, good way to celebrate.
Nathaniel Langner 04:27
And then
Liz Haynes 04:28
Did I answer that question?
Nathaniel Langner 04:29
When
Liz Haynes 04:31
Pardon me?
Nathaniel Langner 04:32
Sorry, when it started to change into COVID? Did you feel safe still going into the clinics? Or how did that change? Like did it add to the stress of trying to kind of deal with your cancer diagnosis?
Liz Haynes 04:46
It added to the stress because I was worried about completing my radiation treatments. I was worried if I got COVID, would I be able to to continue And when I, when I asked my radiation tech, he said that if I were to be diagnosed with COVID, they would have me as the last appointment for the day. And they would gown up and protect themselves, then have me have radiation. So as it turned out, I have never had COVID. And I didn't, uh, I didn't have any complications. But yes, it made me feel pretty insecure.
Nathaniel Langner 05:31
Okay, but do you feel like the hospital adapted to the changes relatively well, according to like, all the kinds of fears that were?
Liz Haynes 05:44
I don't know if they, they, whenever I expressed a fear they addressed it. Oh, yeah. Don't worry, Liz, we'll figure your way out of it. But I don't know that that helped so much diminishing the stress, but the people at the U. And at that radiation clinic were lovely. I mean, they were extremely helpful and very caring. And so, but but it was a matter of going alone. Bob could have Bob could have taken me there. But he couldn't have come in to be waiting to wait for me through the treatment. So I would have I It was basically go it alone.
Nathaniel Langner 06:25
Mmmhmm, and can you kind of expand on like that feeling of going alone? If you feel comfortable talking about that? Like, how does that impact someone that's going through this do you believe like, personally?
Liz Haynes 06:37
You know, through the radiation treatment, it wasn't, it wasn't so difficult. All radiation did, difference, Chemo makes people very sick. Radiation just made me very tired. So by 20, treatment, 20, 21, I was pretty exhausted, and getting there and home, I was really tired. But, uh, that wasn't the problem. The problem was six weeks later, I had to have that radiation area, uh, removed from my leg. And that was June 1, and I had to do, I had to do the whole hospitalization alone. Bob was able to take me to the hospital and pick me up. But I had to go into the surgery myself, and, uh, and take all the information they gave me after the surgery. And, um, I felt kind of vulnerable. Because when you come out of come out of surgery, you're not real, you're not, you're not with it. You know, you you're still under sedation, and they're trying to tell you things and they're giving you notes, and they gave me all the information I needed. But there were points that if they had made more clearly, Bob would have, Bob being there, would have watched for things that, nothing went badly wrong. But a couple of things went wrong. And they made it difficult, because I was not aware. And then I looked at the material and the material said yes, don't do this. Yeah. But it was like, real easy. Like don't drive the don't drive a vehicle. Don't uncover your wound. I mean, it was no more forceful. The things that went wrong. So I felt more vulnerable than maybe I would have if Bob had been there.
Nathaniel Langner 08:40
Okay, and then did the hospital like put a support system there? Like, was it just still mainly nurses and doctors? Or was there a new mediators that they created to kind of facilitate that information?
Liz Haynes 08:51
It was pretty early on it was June 1 Nate so I think it was maybe only two and a half months into the process. And, and, and I made drawing indication when I came back that it was unfair to have people go into this type of surgery without someone there to be their support, you know, to someone who was their advocate.
Nathaniel Langner 09:17
Okay, and then moving out of the hospital into like, time back at home.
Liz Haynes 09:22
Yup.
Nathaniel Langner 09:23
How did that kind of change your like day to day life? Like, what kind of hobbies did you develop any new hobbies? Or was there any like new things you started to find at home that you weren't really doing pre COVID?
Liz Haynes 09:34
Yeah, the surgery took me solidly to the middle of July before I was kind of back on my feet. I had after the surgery. It was very painful. They took a large section of my skin and the fat underneath it in my leg, uh, out and it was far more painful than I expected. So I spent a lot of time just immobilized a lot of time on the couch, a lot of time, I couldn't bathe myself. I really took Bob had to be responsible to take care of me. Then, after the second week, I went back to see the surgeon, and found out that only half of my skin graft had taken. And when I asked him what to do about that, he said he would suggest I have second surgery. So I had a second surgery, June 25th, 22nd, excuse me. But the thing that I find interesting is that went to all of these things alone. And I think typically surgeons Don't, don't think to give you the information. So there were a lot of things that made me anxious, that if they had realized, like, I thought that I'd done something wrong, that the skin graft didn't take. Well, it took till two weeks after the second surgery, before the surgeon's assistant said, "Oh, no, no, lots of skin grafts don't take". So I found that whether it's COVID related, or just how surgeons are, I wasn't given information that helped calm me about that this was part of the process. And I was doing okay. And I just imagined that it was something to do with the cancer again, and my leg was, you know, something was wrong. So and not good. It, it, it, it wasn't so I don't know, does that answer your question?
Nathaniel Langner 11:46
Yeah, of course. And then going, like, further, like, during this time, were there things that you found that could calm you down, you're talking about you kind of like, we're not completely informed in that, like, provide a lot of stress on your life. But were there ways
Liz Haynes 12:00
Yeah
Nathaniel Langner 12:00
that you kind of dealt with that and like hobbies or like pastimes that kind of gave you that sense of calm, that would help kind of, in this time?
Liz Haynes 12:10
Truthfully made, I've had two surgeries that were kind of years ago, and I found after this surgery, that it knocked my feet out from me, under me enough that I was really not able to do, I was really not even for a period of maybe three weeks, four weeks, read, like read a magazine or read a book and I trip, typ, but truthfully, all I did was recovery and how to recover and have Bob take care of me. You know, so I, hobbies didn't come untill later. And then, you know, the the community center was closed. My leg was uncomfortable. I just didn't do much. You know?
Nathaniel Langner 13:04
Okay, now I'd opportunity to talk to you almost a year from that moment.
Liz Haynes 13:07
Yes
Nathaniel Langner 13:08
Is there now things that you feel like you can do with COVID Still that you still feel safe?
Liz Haynes 13:16
I
Nathaniel Langner 13:16
So you've now discovered
Liz Haynes 13:18
Well, Bob and I are both twice vaccinated. So my Vax last vaccine was March the last Friday in March. So I'm, I'm covered. So now I am starting to out okay. On what was it February 25. I had a rotator cuff surgery. Because we had a bad year, I had rotator cuff surgery and recovering from the leg was simpler. It was more painful. But it didn't it it made me limp and limited some of my mobility, but this surgery, prevent it, it changed all the things I could do. Cause right handed [unknown word, phone begins ringing in background] worry about how to dress myself how to you know and Bob had to do a lot of it. So the only thing that I've been starting to be more enthusiastic about again, is gardening. I've started doing a few yoga poses, again that are standing nothing that bears weight on my shoulders or my arms. But I've been able to go out and sighting pick up sticks, pick up sticks in the yard, pull a few weeds with my left hand. Kind of nothing more than that they figure they figured you're not mostly recovered from this surgery until about six months. So I'm hoping that two months from now I'll be able to kind of like get back in the pool, or get back in that lake a little bit. And paddle around and, and all of that. So yeah, it's been, I have kind of emotionally, it's been a struggle. And I've kind of given the whole last year, and I've kind of given up doing a lot of positive things they just wind and recovered.
Nathaniel Langner 15:25
And then kind of going after, or like, the positive things you have kind of gotten more into gardening. Do you think that's connected with like, COVID? And like how you've been experiencing life? Or is that just a thing you've been passionate about, like your whole life, and it just connects back?
Liz Haynes 15:39
Not my whole life. But most of my I would say that I really started gardening in my 40s. So it's something I'm thrilled about. And I'm it's something I'm looking, you know, I have found a gardener who can help me put in gardens this year. So I'm excited about those kinds of things.
Nathaniel Langner 16:00
And for the gardener, did you find the gardener pre COVID? Or did you have to find them during this time period?
Liz Haynes 16:07
Right smack in the middle.
Nathaniel Langner 16:09
Okay
Liz Haynes 16:09
I was I was at Bachmann's in Maplewood. And I ran into a very cheerful little energetic woman who, who we started talking and she started offering to, you know, for pay, of course, to come out and do some yard work and stuff like that. So I'm quite excited about having her and us building a hosta garden this year. And you coming over to see it.
Nathaniel Langner 16:37
Of course, and then going out like off of the vaccination concept. How were your feelings? Before you got the vaccine like about it? Were you worried about it? Did you think it was a positive thing? Or like something like your thought process about the vaccine in general?
Liz Haynes 16:52
I was I've never feared having the vaccine. I think people who are judgmental Yes. Instead, people who overreact and refuse that refuse to take them really need to start believing in science. You know, and I've taken for years, I've taken a flu vaccine every year. Whatever they give me if the doctor suggests it, so I was ready to take the vaccine. And because of the way it was rolled out, for the state of Minnesota, it people, lots of people got it before me. And I kept saying to Bob, "Well, come on, I had cancer last year, you shouldn't be able to get on the COVID list right away, you know". And it turned out, it turned out that as it was once they scheduled my rotator cuff surgery, they didn't want me to have the COVID shot until a week after this either a full week before or a full week after. So as it turned out, I got my first vaccination, the first Friday in February in March, excuse me.
Nathaniel Langner 18:05
Okay. And then with that did feel like kind of a weight was lifted off your shoulder like do you feel like life is a little bit more normal now?
Liz Haynes 18:15
You know, since I don't know if it matters that people know that you and I have been close for for years. Last week was the first week in 15 months that we had friends over for lunch on Friday. And we played cards. First time in 15 months. My brother and his wife stopped by on their way home from an outing on Saturday and visited to see the things we'd done in the house. And then two of my nieces the twins came over Friday. So Saturday. So in that week, we actually had six people in the house.
Nathaniel Langner 19:00
Okay.
Liz Haynes 19:00
That's the first time first time in 15 months. And, and, I guess I haven't told you I had forgotten. I've also we've also had some things done in the house things painted things fixed up. So that's been a nice distraction to through this winter.
Nathaniel Langner 19:19
Okay. And then going back to the vaccine, I guess, did you have any side effects or any like negative things after was it worth it in general?
Liz Haynes 19:29
Eight first shot was eight days after my rotator cuff surgery. And I had I was feeling every it was hard because every bump that I hit while he was driving me to the vaccine hurt and I was standing hurt and by the time I got done with it, I felt crummy. And then three weeks later, I had that same day I had my CT scan, my MRI, my follow up with my cancer surgeon on that Friday before the shot. So by the time I got home, I had a headache, and I was tired, I took a nap now, whether it was the COVID shot shot, or whether it was too much out too much. I can't tell you, but I never felt feverish or sick to my stomach or anything like that. So I think I came through it without any symptoms.
Nathaniel Langner 20:35
Okay, and then so moving off of the vaccine again. And you were talking about how now you have more people in your life being able to come over.
Liz Haynes 20:43
Yeah.
Nathaniel Langner 20:44
Previously, we talked about like, your emphasis on travel, do you feel like you can start traveling again? Or how did it influence your travel at like pre COVID, during COVID, and looking to the future, like just let's talk about traveling for a little bit.
Liz Haynes 20:58
Let's talk. Let's talk about traveling.
Liz Haynes 21:01
We you know, Nate, I love we love to travel. We had cold because of my cancer, which happened. February 4, 13th, I was diagnosed we were scheduled to leave for Thailand, about ew, seven days, 10 days after my cancer diagnosis. So that was cancelled because of cancer. Well, Bobby's birthday is in May. And we were scheduled to go to Egypt in May. And that was cancelled because of COVID. November, we were scheduled to go to Morocco. And that was cancelled because of COVID. Currently, a lot of companies are pushing travel again. But you know, you can't get into Canada. There's lots of places in like Europe that aren't aren't good. So we have a we have a trip scheduled for the Caucasus September, and it makes me a little nervous to think about going there. But I and I'm not even sure we'll make it but I am ready to go for this to be done and to go someplace. And I mean, I think everybody should go to Azerbaijan. You know, you should you should come with that to the Caucasus Nate instead of finishing school.
Nathaniel Langner 21:01
Yeah.
Nathaniel Langner 22:28
Yeah, and then going off of like the cancellation. Was it canceled? Did they cancel themselves? Or how was reimbursement? Or how was that?
Liz Haynes 22:38
Okay, we cancelled, we cancelled cancer, we canceled Thailand. And we always because we're old, we always buy insurance. Because then you just lose that, then you just lose the insurance. And so I all we lost was the cost of the insurance.
Nathaniel Langner 22:58
Okay.
Nathaniel Langner 22:58
Okay
Liz Haynes 22:58
Now, the Thailand trip, they have they have taken our money and put it on our trip to Morocco in November. So they just moved our money. Now, the scheduled trip for a for where else are we scheduled for? We have something in February that they that they moved, oh, we're Egypt, we're supposed to go to Egypt in February, and the money from Egypt was moved to Egypt. And then the money from the trip to Morocco was moved to Morocco. So when we go to when we go to the caucuses, if we go knock wood in September, we have just a downpayment on it now, so we'll have to pay. So they've kept our money and move the money to the next trip.
Liz Haynes 23:36
Which is okay with us.
Nathaniel Langner 23:52
Yeah, so that seems so without insurance, you feel like it would have been a lot different. Or,
Liz Haynes 23:58
You know, the problem is you if with trips they have they allow you to cancel with an increased loss of money and they get close. I travel insurance, they will reimburse you the whole cost, even if you just decide you don't want to go except for the cost of the insurance. So we've since I've since we've been retired, we always buy insurance today.
Nathaniel Langner 24:30
So to finalize our conversation on travel, are the your planned future trips, are those cheaper than they were previously or is the cost pretty similar?
Liz Haynes 24:41
Pretty similar. Pretty similar. And we're, we're talking about maybe, you know, I don't know if you know, I have an older sister who lives in California, and my younger brother Tom and I were talking about making a road trip to see her so we may be and if we don't do that, we may be doing a trip also to see a cousin in Florida later this late fall or early winter. But you know we we haven't driven around the country either. I miss going places Nate. Heck Nate, I miss going to Net Lake.
Nathaniel Langner 25:16
Yeah, of course it definitely has changed. So kind of going
Liz Haynes 25:20
Yeah.
Nathaniel Langner 25:20
off that did you feel like in the heart you really felt like you had to listen to science and like quarantine and stay at home. Did you buy into that or?
Liz Haynes 25:29
Oh yeah, oh yeah.
Nathaniel Langner 25:30
We're kind of starting to talk about like how that shaped you.
Liz Haynes 25:33
I bought into it about 85 90% Bob bought into to about 100 105, Bob. We just nobody could come here if they weren't wearing a mask. He didn't want anybody in the house and I I'm grateful that he was more adamant than I was about it. So yeah, we've been real sticklers.
Nathaniel Langner 25:56
Okay, and did that like, make you feel a little more secure? During like, all the uncertainty or [trails off, unknown word].
Liz Haynes 26:04
You know, I don't know if that made me more or less secure. It made me lonelier, made me feel lonelier, you know, heck, haven't gotten to see your parents. Are you very much through all of this, you know.
Nathaniel Langner 26:17
And, how was your experience with like, going to like, get groceries and other stuff when you're trying to like, protect yourself? Like, did you go at certain times? Was there a certain like, way you would do it? Did you wash your hands a lot sanitizer, masks like before masks, just stuff like that.
Liz Haynes 26:34
Um, I can tell you for me because of cancer, radiation, the surgery, the recovery from the surgery, then my rotator cuff, I have maybe gone grocery shopping, a 10th of the time that Bob has. Bob has taken over most of the responsibility for the grocery shopping so and we have hand sanitizers in both cars. When we get to wherever we're going, we make sure if the if the carts haven't been sanitized, or someone's they're not there to tell us we sanitize the cart, we wear masks. Because we're retired, we can do any do it off peak, you know, he can go shopping at 11 in the morning or one in the afternoon. And and and he does that I have my outings. Now are physical therapy, I started physical therapy four weeks after my rotator cuff surgery and I see them twice a week. Now they've all because their medical employees, they've all been vaccinated themselves. So I feel comfortable with them. But yes, they're masked, I'm masked the place the room is clean before I come in and cleaned after I leave. So yeah, I have felt safe.
Liz Haynes 26:35
Okay. And then have you had physical therapy prior to this experience?
Liz Haynes 28:05
Yeah, I do
Nathaniel Langner 28:09
And do you feel like that has, there's been like a noticeable change when you walk in to get physical therapy now like how they [unknown word].
Liz Haynes 28:23
Sure, sure. I had physical therapy after my surgery. And that's when they were beginning to in June. And so yes, they were wearing masks, but I've had physical therapy with this group be for a couple of times. So you know, you get old things fall apart, you know, and they've always been very warm and welcoming. And there were often one or two clients in the waiting room. Now they're there, nobody sits in the waiting room anymore. You walk in the door, they check you in and they put you in a in a room where you're going to have your physical therapy, so you don't and in the past, if I needed to be on a bike, like when I had my leg done, that I did a lot of biking, but they made sure the bike was clean before I sat on it and after. And that no one else was anywhere near me. If there was somebody else on a bike, we did something else, you know what I mean? So they did a lot to just make sure everybody was fine and okay.
Nathaniel Langner 29:41
Then we just talked about the ways you are protecting yourself. What were your feelings about masks in general before like mask mandate? Did you feel like they were like an important factor and you were wearing them before? Or did you wait until they were really encouraged?
Liz Haynes 29:57
No, we wore them from the beginning. I mean, every any Fauci and Mike Osterholm and, you know, people, people hear that, that we hear on the news that we're supposed to know stuff, sad, mask, wear it clean your hands keep a safe distance. So we tried to do all of those things.
Nathaniel Langner 30:20
Then you were just talking about people that know stuff. And you're at the beginning, you're talking about you kind of struggled to read stuff. How were you getting your information? Was it through like, the news? Were you reading it? And then like, kind of like, from your sources?
Liz Haynes 30:35
Well, you know, mostly, it's the news on television. I tend to sometimes I tend to watch MSNBC a little more. Anytime Fauci was on we listen to him. And, and same with Mike Osterholm. I mean, I think he's a remarkable guy. He's been, he's been the Minnesota Epidemiologist for years. And I, I've kind of listened to him for years. So mostly, we got our information through television.
Nathaniel Langner 31:12
Were you getting any information like directly from your doctors when you were going to the hospital or was it mostly just from like the news?
Liz Haynes 31:21
if we were going to the hospital, they there was always a pre, unless it was just an appointment. But if I was going to surgery, there was pre op stuff. And also the hospital would contact and say, you have to do this, this and this before you come in, you have to come by yourself or not, you have to come in by yourself, but you have to be driven by somebody. So there was a lot of information from the hospital about how, how I could come in, you know what I needed to do before I was allowed in. Same with the radiation, of 25 radiation appointments. You came into the front door, you had to stand six feet away from the person in front of you. Then you went to the front and you were met by an intake person who had a plastic shield in front of them and a face mask and plastic shield before and you were after you were checked in and your temperature was taken. Then you were sent along. And during this whole experience starting in December, I also had dental problems also went to the U and I found those same responses, you know, you have to you have to you have to temperature you before you can come in and you have to have an appointment before before they let you even even in the building. So yeah.
Nathaniel Langner 32:58
And then so with most of your medical procedures, was most of it done at the U or the University of Minnesota or did you go to other clinics?
Liz Haynes 33:08
Yeah, I would, uh, all of my cancer stuff was done at the U. The intake was there. They had the they had the, um um, sarcoma clinic there. So luckily I was they were 20 minutes away. But my rotator cuff surgery, I had the MRI and scan on it at Summit orthopedics in Badness heights. And that's where I have the surgery. And I've had physical therapy at a place called New Heights Performance, which is I don't know, but it's it's it's down 35 the south a little bit over 494.
Nathaniel Langner 33:54
But you'd say that all of your experiences were pretty much they had the same procedures of like the plexiglass the temperatures and sanitizing. Was there one that was like better than the other or were they all pretty much seemed to implement the same policies.
Liz Haynes 34:07
They did not they do. My [unknown word]. You're at that peak appointments. But they have but the women are behind the receptionists are behind the plexiglass, when they come to take you to your room. They're all masks, and you know, you stay six feet apart, but no, I, I don't. It's only at the U that I've had my temperature taken all the time.
Nathaniel Langner 34:31
Okay. And then kind of going off, like mass mandates and like temperatures, how do you feel like government responded at a state level? Do you feel like they responded adequately or did you feel like you were confused at some point or is there anything you want to add about?
Liz Haynes 34:49
I think Walz did a great job handling Minnesota. I think he was a voice of calm and reason. And I think he is Uh, I think he did a good job. You know, I'm okay with Walz. Now, if we want to get off on the national level, I think Trump turned a blind eye and made things worse rather than better. But that's, you know, that's certainly all past, you know.
Nathaniel Langner 35:19
Then going off. Sorry, I keep saying going on.
Liz Haynes 35:22
No, sure, whatever.
Nathaniel Langner 35:22
When we're talking about the calming response, do you think that was almost just as important as the policies implemented just having like a governor or a leader that you could kind of feel like, could calm or like you could trust was that just as important as the policies that were implemented?
Liz Haynes 35:40
I don't know if they were as important as the policies, because I think wearing a mask and closing down businesses and as much as as much upheaval as that created, I think was probably the most important, but it never hurts to have a calm voice saying, you know, stay calm and carry on. You know, I mean, there's nothing wrong with trying to act like Winston Churchill. So yeah, I think the fact that we had Governor Walz, and it didn't help that, that he wasn't in conflict with with the rest of government, you know, so many other states have have conflict. I mean, wasn't it Michigan, where the state of Michigan went to this to the, brought legit legislations against the female governor about closing down businesses?
Nathaniel Langner 36:43
Even in Wisconsin, the governor and the legislative and the judicial all were clashing at the same time?
Liz Haynes 36:49
Well, he did end in and it's doesn't present a united front. And you know, united front in a matter of crisis is pretty important. I think.
Nathaniel Langner 37:03
We just talked about businesses closing, were you impacted by that? Or were you just really just focused on staying home? So restaurants closing didn't really impact you? Or do you know, anyone that was really impacted by that? Like, having, [Liz begins speaking and Nathaniels audio is unintelligable for the end of this sentence].
Liz Haynes 37:18
I don't, I'm lucky enough that I don't know anybody who had lost a job. Now, I think, the closest to me about about people who were really impacted by work, were your parents. Yet, this whole thing made a big difference in in what they could do with their work. I have family members, nieces, nephews, whatever, who've worked from home, you know, been able to work from home. And there were a couple at the beginning, who were unemployed until their businesses opened back up. And one of them being my nephew is who is the manager in a dental office.
Nathaniel Langner 38:10
Okay.
Liz Haynes 38:10
And when once they opened dentistry, again, he was able to get his shots and go back to work, but knock wood, I don't know, a lot of people I don't know, anybody who's been really economically, dramatically impacted from this. And in fact, we can't spend money, we can't go out to eat, we can't travel. We ended up having a little more money this year, than we had 15 years 15 months ago, we're saving for our next trips Nate. You know, we've got our money put away for some of our next trips. But um no, I don't know, anybody who other than changing their lives not being able to see their children or their grandchildren. I don't you know, where your social life is altered? I don't know any, and you are the only person I know who has had COVID.
Nathaniel Langner 39:10
Just kind of ask. So there's closely impacted by you that had COVID
Liz Haynes 39:16
Just you know, I we had a couple of I have a couple of friends said Oh, my son has it or one of my friends. One of my friends who lives, Patti, I don't know if you've met Patti, but she lives half time in Palm Springs. Her son in law got COVID while he was visiting her I can't remember sometime in May of last March, maybe April of last year and he's one of those what did they call them the long timers? Where he's been sick and it's taken him months to recover? But I you know, personally you know you you are it buddy.
Nathaniel Langner 39:58
That's an accomplishment.
Liz Haynes 40:01
Well, I'm glad you're fully recovered.
Nathaniel Langner 40:03
Yes, I am too. Were there any policies specifically government related in the city of Little Canada that you noticed them going above and beyond? Did you have like any? Was there anything coming out Little Canada that you felt like?
Liz Haynes 40:17
Were there anything about no emails? No, nothing in the mail? No, you know, there was no city wide mailing or contacting? No, I didn't notice anything. You know.
Nathaniel Langner 40:31
And then I guess one final question relate to government, government we had there are some elections throughout the time of COVID. Did you feel Did you vote by absentee ballot? Or do you go in person?
Liz Haynes 40:45
We, we didn't go in person we did drop off. So it you know, it's not exactly absentee. But we got our ballots, and we took it down to the, the library and in in Roseville, and dropped our, dropped our ballots and voting off there. So yes, we voted.
Nathaniel Langner 41:07
If there was no COVID, would you have just when you have done the same thing? Or would you have probably just stood in line and don't like normal?
Liz Haynes 41:15
I always stand in line. The only time I've voted this way before is we were got one of the elections, we were gone somewhere. And we had to we had to put an absentee ballot in. But no, we stand in line and do our, you know, you vote we just vote.
Nathaniel Langner 41:35
And then moving towards the future. Because if I would have interviewed you six months ago or even a year, it would have been a completely different narrative. So now there's seems to be a little bit more of hope with the vaccine. Is there anything you want to add about that help there? We talked about traveling but anything else you look forward to in the future coming out of this time?
Liz Haynes 41:57
Yes. I think people over for lunch, having a having a post COVID, post cancer. See my new gardens, look at my new tapestry open house party where we can feed people and hug people and you can even have a beer at my house now that you're 21 you know, yeah, I miss I miss. I miss the socializing. I'm also I want I've been thinking seriously of volunteering at Children's Hospital. Well, I can't do that. Until all of this is settled down. So I'm, I'm hoping that get things settled down and start doing some volunteer work. Oh, I'm forgetting Net Lake. Good Lord going up to the lake and seeing people there. And you know, and why would you see I don't go to the lake because well, first of all, I haven't been well enough, but it's not like you can use it anybody. You just, you know, you're just there. So okay.
Nathaniel Langner 43:06
And then next, one of your brothers lives up towards that area. Did he kind of reiterate any like changes from like, your closer to like the city like rural and urban like how they were impacted differently? Or do you [unknown word]?
Liz Haynes 43:21
Okay, yes, he was he the only thing he is sad is that how many people in the room were in a conservative area. You know, Pine County is where half of the lake is in Pine County. And that voted, I believe they went for Trump and Carlton County, which is the other half of the lake went for, went for Biden. And he will talk about the people in Pine County, who won't wear a mask. And he he just says that he thinks that there's a more conservative bent up there, up near where the lake is, and people just, you know, don't wear masks. I think part of it is for a long time Nate, people thought they were safe if they did. Or if they lived up in Cloquet, Minnesota or up on the Iron Range. It was like they thought they were going to be safe from COVID. And I remember reading oh, at the beginning of it or hearing Fauci or, or or Michael Osterholm, your home say, you know, you guys are safe for now. But when it happens there, it will spread like wildfire there. And that's what it's done. So, you know, I don't understand people who won't wear masks.
Nathaniel Langner 44:51
Yeah. Were there any other concerns related to COVID that you want to bring up or feel like any other stories or anything you feel like it's important to share?
Liz Haynes 45:02
Well, you know, I have a passel of stories, but nothing specifically COVID. You know?
Nathaniel Langner 45:14
You feel like the vaccine will, has brought a little more positive mood to the view, do you feel like with the vaccine, we will move out of this sooner than later? Or do you feel like there's still going to be a long road ahead or a little bit in between?
Liz Haynes 45:33
I think, I think there'll be a road ahead. And I think what I found, I found really interesting, I was listening to some news report, and they talked about, I, 60 minutes, I think, had a story about how they are learning to take the virus, and within like six weeks, create, maybe I'm making up time, but within a very short period of time, determine what the virus is, and determine how to create a vaccine. So they are figuring ways that in the future, when we get other pandemics, they will have the knowledge of creating a vaccine or treatment of some sort for that. So I feel heartened by this is this has forced medicine and science to figure out how to handle something like this in the future.
Nathaniel Langner 46:30
So I know the year has been hard for you specifically and for everyone else. But going off that is there like any other bright spot that you see coming out of this? Or is it really just centered around sciences now like forced to, like confront this at a higher rate than they probably would have, and they got probably more funding than they would have without such like uh.
Liz Haynes 46:51
And I you know, I think I think I think we learned something from it now, whether it whether it will show up in my lifetime or not. I don't I don't know. You know, you can, you can I hate to sound polyamish, but you can take a situation that is difficult. And wine, which is a lot of what I did this year with my cancer and my surgery, or you can figure a way to walk through it with some humor. And I think this is really highlighted for people. You know, you turn the light on yourself. And you think well now how well did I do this? And I didn't do it very well for a lot of things. But what can I learn about it? How do I see myself and hopefully people can take this experience, myself included, and use it a lot, a little more cheerfully or optimistically?
Nathaniel Langner 47:57
Yeah, I think that's a very important thing to learn from it. There's a lot of like human character has been developed through this struggle, and not just this way.
Liz Haynes 48:06
And I think, and I think it's also been pointed out how frail and frightening how frail and frightened some people are from this experience, you know, and and hopefully we learn from it, you know?
Nathaniel Langner 48:23
And has it made you more afraid of it happening again, sooner? Or are you just glad to try and make it through this one? Or are you like is it become like, more like epidemics and pandemics? Has that become more of a topic of discussion or like on your mind than it was previously?
Liz Haynes 48:42
Do you remember? Do you remember when the E. coli was coming out of Africa?
Nathaniel Langner 48:46
Yeah, Ebola.
Liz Haynes 48:47
Not E. coli, Ebola. Yeah, they both sound similar.
Nathaniel Langner 48:52
Thats an issue.
Liz Haynes 48:53
Yes, that's true. But Michael auster home, and I brought him up three or four times. And he told me that he was the epidemiologist in Minnesota and he talked about it didn't it wasn't a matter of if it was a matter of when there would be another worldwide pandemic. That scared me kind of kind of scared the hell out of me. But now, I think of how much science has learned to create new vaccines in such a limited time span and effective vaccine vaccines and how much they've learned about mapping the, the structure of of the pandemic of the virus. I am somewhat heartened by that. You know, my complete aside and if you want to edit this out, that's fine. My mother was born in 1918. And, and that's the year that she of February of 1918, that year that that Spanish flu came along, and she was the third of four children in the family and her mother nearly died. And her mother was a young woman 30, 35 At the time, but she nearly died. And that I remember her talking to me about that. And interesting how similar this pandemic is 100 years later, you know, history repeating itself, my history major friend.
Nathaniel Langner 50:35
Yes. So through your own oral history, do you feel like we have made like any, like major changes? Or do you think it's still very similar to what happened on 100 years ago? And like, do you think we made better decisions this time around learning from the past? Or do you think we kind of repeated a lot?
Liz Haynes 50:51
You know, the things I've seen about it the good in 1918, there were a lot of people in masks, and there were people trying to get out of cities to to get away from get distancing. So it's interesting that that keeping clean, staying away, putting on a mask hasn't changed much. But the medicine has changed. You know, I mean, I don't know that. I don't know if they ever came up with a vaccine, or a treatment for that pandemic, interestingly, Nate it started in Kansas.
Liz Haynes 51:33
If you, yep, it started in Kansas with those servicemen who then went over to World War One. So I always say to Bob cam, because since he's a Kansas, you know, pandemic started in Kansas, but so I think the thing that's more optimistic is that we have medical, medical, that's much improved medical treatment and science. That's much improved. And hopefully, you know, we won't have another one in my lifetime.
Nathaniel Langner 51:33
Yeah.
Nathaniel Langner 52:11
Hopefully not.
Liz Haynes 52:12
Ones enough, you know.
Nathaniel Langner 52:15
And then I guess, starting to end this conversation, is there anything in your day to day life that you feel like you'll change? Like, you're talking about bringing people back into your home, but when you go out of your home? Is there things you like, question touching, like, you feel like, the sanitizer, or like, is there small things that you took for granted previously, that you'll kind of do differently?
Liz Haynes 52:39
I think that I think that when we when we traveled, we will be all wearing masks. I think that there will be residual mask wearing in this in this culture, I think because because I think we you know, it appears that 40 What did I see? That said something about 40% of Republican males? Were not willing to get the vaccine.
Nathaniel Langner 53:05
Yep.
Liz Haynes 53:06
Which that's a big percentage of people. You know, and and, and so, it I don't know that it'll ever be like, smallpox wiped out, or meat or polio wiped out, but we might be wearing masks for a good share of the rest of my life.
Nathaniel Langner 53:24
Okay.
Liz Haynes 53:25
You know, why do you have about you?
Nathaniel Langner 53:29
Yeah, I think there will definitely be some, like side effects or things that like, shake up our culture and start to change the world we live in. And then is there anything else you feel like you want to share before ending this conversation? Because thank you so much for taking time out of your day. And it really means a lot.
Liz Haynes 53:49
Well, I you can you can edit this to you know, almost any reason to spend an hour on the phone with you works for me.
Nathaniel Langner 53:56
Perfect.
Liz Haynes 53:57
Do you know of it? Yes, yes. Yes. And I hope you're welcome. And I hope to see you sometime this summer at the lake. Have you had your vaccine?
Nathaniel Langner 54:07
I have.
This is an interview with Liz Haynes she is located in Little Canada, Minnesota, I am interviewing her from Eau Claire, Wisconsin, it is 1:38 of April 21 of 2021. Currently, there are 141 million COVID cases in the world with 3 million deaths. In the United States, there have been 31.8 million with 568 deaths, er, 568,000 deaths. In the state of Wisconsin, there has been 65,300 cases with 7,427 deaths resulting. Okay, so I'll start you with some simple questions. And we'll just talk about those and kind of learn about your experiences with COVID. And how your life has changed. So could you just start by listing kind of like your ethnicity, your race and your age?
Liz Haynes 00:59
My mother's family was German. And my father's and and and Dutch, and my father's family was German and Irish. Oh, and English. Excuse me.
Nathaniel Langner 01:11
Okay, thank you very much.
Liz Haynes 01:14
White.
Nathaniel Langner 01:15
Do you have a job at the moment? Or what is your day to day life consists of?
Liz Haynes 01:19
I am retired.
Nathaniel Langner 01:22
How long have you been retired for?
Liz Haynes 01:24
It was as of April 1, it was 11 years.
Nathaniel Langner 01:28
So you're working? No jobs at the time of when COVID started?
Liz Haynes 01:32
No, I was not.
Nathaniel Langner 01:34
Okay. And as we stayed you live in Little Canada, correct?
Liz Haynes 01:38
Yes, sir.
Nathaniel Langner 01:39
Okay, and what's life in like Locanda, like, currently? Or what was it like pre COVID If you just want to summarize, like, kind of like simple day to day life back before COVID,
Liz Haynes 01:50
Pre-COVID, both Bob and I are retired. So I was able to go to the community center. If I wanted to, we could go shopping, we did a great deal of traveling. And traveling has stopped completely. We're lucky we've been able to do kind of whatever we want for the last decade, pre-COVID.
Nathaniel Langner 02:12
So I think I'm talking about the travel would be a really important section coming up. But focusing just on like the community center right now.
Liz Haynes 02:19
Yes
Nathaniel Langner 02:20
How has that changed? Like, can you go to the community center anymore? Are there shorter class sizes? Or have you just decide to refrain from doing anything?
Liz Haynes 02:27
No, I, I have decided to refrain for any of those reasons, I have decided to refrain because I had rotator cuff surgery about eight weeks ago. And before that, I was recovering from a rare form of cancer. So they that that kind of kept me out of the loop for a while.
Nathaniel Langner 02:51
Okay, and then building off of that.
Liz Haynes 02:53
Yes.
Nathaniel Langner 02:53
So when were you diagnosed with cancer? Was that pre COVID? Or was it during COVID?
Liz Haynes 02:58
It was just before COVID I had surgery to remove, lipoma from my leg, February 7 of 2020. And I was diagnosed with spiral sarcoma, February 13 of 2020. So just before the shutdown,
Nathaniel Langner 03:19
okay, so pre shutdown, what was your experience like at the hospital and your support system where people are able to come and support you there? And how did that change after
Liz Haynes 03:30
They could have come if I needed to, but but the surgery was to remove the lipoma was simple. The diagnosis, Bob came with me to the U. And coincidentally, the U has a sarcoma clinic. And because it's fairly rare, it's unique to the U to have this, this clinic. So we were able to go to my appointments together to get the gist of treatments and what they would do, I started radiation treating this because this treatment for this cancer was 25 days of radiation. And I started those, those those, those [unknown word] 2020, which coincidentally was two days after my 70th birthday. So you know, good way to celebrate.
Nathaniel Langner 04:27
And then
Liz Haynes 04:28
Did I answer that question?
Nathaniel Langner 04:29
When
Liz Haynes 04:31
Pardon me?
Nathaniel Langner 04:32
Sorry, when it started to change into COVID? Did you feel safe still going into the clinics? Or how did that change? Like did it add to the stress of trying to kind of deal with your cancer diagnosis?
Liz Haynes 04:46
It added to the stress because I was worried about completing my radiation treatments. I was worried if I got COVID, would I be able to to continue And when I, when I asked my radiation tech, he said that if I were to be diagnosed with COVID, they would have me as the last appointment for the day. And they would gown up and protect themselves, then have me have radiation. So as it turned out, I have never had COVID. And I didn't, uh, I didn't have any complications. But yes, it made me feel pretty insecure.
Nathaniel Langner 05:31
Okay, but do you feel like the hospital adapted to the changes relatively well, according to like, all the kinds of fears that were?
Liz Haynes 05:44
I don't know if they, they, whenever I expressed a fear they addressed it. Oh, yeah. Don't worry, Liz, we'll figure your way out of it. But I don't know that that helped so much diminishing the stress, but the people at the U. And at that radiation clinic were lovely. I mean, they were extremely helpful and very caring. And so, but but it was a matter of going alone. Bob could have Bob could have taken me there. But he couldn't have come in to be waiting to wait for me through the treatment. So I would have I It was basically go it alone.
Nathaniel Langner 06:25
Mmmhmm, and can you kind of expand on like that feeling of going alone? If you feel comfortable talking about that? Like, how does that impact someone that's going through this do you believe like, personally?
Liz Haynes 06:37
You know, through the radiation treatment, it wasn't, it wasn't so difficult. All radiation did, difference, Chemo makes people very sick. Radiation just made me very tired. So by 20, treatment, 20, 21, I was pretty exhausted, and getting there and home, I was really tired. But, uh, that wasn't the problem. The problem was six weeks later, I had to have that radiation area, uh, removed from my leg. And that was June 1, and I had to do, I had to do the whole hospitalization alone. Bob was able to take me to the hospital and pick me up. But I had to go into the surgery myself, and, uh, and take all the information they gave me after the surgery. And, um, I felt kind of vulnerable. Because when you come out of come out of surgery, you're not real, you're not, you're not with it. You know, you you're still under sedation, and they're trying to tell you things and they're giving you notes, and they gave me all the information I needed. But there were points that if they had made more clearly, Bob would have, Bob being there, would have watched for things that, nothing went badly wrong. But a couple of things went wrong. And they made it difficult, because I was not aware. And then I looked at the material and the material said yes, don't do this. Yeah. But it was like, real easy. Like don't drive the don't drive a vehicle. Don't uncover your wound. I mean, it was no more forceful. The things that went wrong. So I felt more vulnerable than maybe I would have if Bob had been there.
Nathaniel Langner 08:40
Okay, and then did the hospital like put a support system there? Like, was it just still mainly nurses and doctors? Or was there a new mediators that they created to kind of facilitate that information?
Liz Haynes 08:51
It was pretty early on it was June 1 Nate so I think it was maybe only two and a half months into the process. And, and, and I made drawing indication when I came back that it was unfair to have people go into this type of surgery without someone there to be their support, you know, to someone who was their advocate.
Nathaniel Langner 09:17
Okay, and then moving out of the hospital into like, time back at home.
Liz Haynes 09:22
Yup.
Nathaniel Langner 09:23
How did that kind of change your like day to day life? Like, what kind of hobbies did you develop any new hobbies? Or was there any like new things you started to find at home that you weren't really doing pre COVID?
Liz Haynes 09:34
Yeah, the surgery took me solidly to the middle of July before I was kind of back on my feet. I had after the surgery. It was very painful. They took a large section of my skin and the fat underneath it in my leg, uh, out and it was far more painful than I expected. So I spent a lot of time just immobilized a lot of time on the couch, a lot of time, I couldn't bathe myself. I really took Bob had to be responsible to take care of me. Then, after the second week, I went back to see the surgeon, and found out that only half of my skin graft had taken. And when I asked him what to do about that, he said he would suggest I have second surgery. So I had a second surgery, June 25th, 22nd, excuse me. But the thing that I find interesting is that went to all of these things alone. And I think typically surgeons Don't, don't think to give you the information. So there were a lot of things that made me anxious, that if they had realized, like, I thought that I'd done something wrong, that the skin graft didn't take. Well, it took till two weeks after the second surgery, before the surgeon's assistant said, "Oh, no, no, lots of skin grafts don't take". So I found that whether it's COVID related, or just how surgeons are, I wasn't given information that helped calm me about that this was part of the process. And I was doing okay. And I just imagined that it was something to do with the cancer again, and my leg was, you know, something was wrong. So and not good. It, it, it, it wasn't so I don't know, does that answer your question?
Nathaniel Langner 11:46
Yeah, of course. And then going, like, further, like, during this time, were there things that you found that could calm you down, you're talking about you kind of like, we're not completely informed in that, like, provide a lot of stress on your life. But were there ways
Liz Haynes 12:00
Yeah
Nathaniel Langner 12:00
that you kind of dealt with that and like hobbies or like pastimes that kind of gave you that sense of calm, that would help kind of, in this time?
Liz Haynes 12:10
Truthfully made, I've had two surgeries that were kind of years ago, and I found after this surgery, that it knocked my feet out from me, under me enough that I was really not able to do, I was really not even for a period of maybe three weeks, four weeks, read, like read a magazine or read a book and I trip, typ, but truthfully, all I did was recovery and how to recover and have Bob take care of me. You know, so I, hobbies didn't come untill later. And then, you know, the the community center was closed. My leg was uncomfortable. I just didn't do much. You know?
Nathaniel Langner 13:04
Okay, now I'd opportunity to talk to you almost a year from that moment.
Liz Haynes 13:07
Yes
Nathaniel Langner 13:08
Is there now things that you feel like you can do with COVID Still that you still feel safe?
Liz Haynes 13:16
I
Nathaniel Langner 13:16
So you've now discovered
Liz Haynes 13:18
Well, Bob and I are both twice vaccinated. So my Vax last vaccine was March the last Friday in March. So I'm, I'm covered. So now I am starting to out okay. On what was it February 25. I had a rotator cuff surgery. Because we had a bad year, I had rotator cuff surgery and recovering from the leg was simpler. It was more painful. But it didn't it it made me limp and limited some of my mobility, but this surgery, prevent it, it changed all the things I could do. Cause right handed [unknown word, phone begins ringing in background] worry about how to dress myself how to you know and Bob had to do a lot of it. So the only thing that I've been starting to be more enthusiastic about again, is gardening. I've started doing a few yoga poses, again that are standing nothing that bears weight on my shoulders or my arms. But I've been able to go out and sighting pick up sticks, pick up sticks in the yard, pull a few weeds with my left hand. Kind of nothing more than that they figure they figured you're not mostly recovered from this surgery until about six months. So I'm hoping that two months from now I'll be able to kind of like get back in the pool, or get back in that lake a little bit. And paddle around and, and all of that. So yeah, it's been, I have kind of emotionally, it's been a struggle. And I've kind of given the whole last year, and I've kind of given up doing a lot of positive things they just wind and recovered.
Nathaniel Langner 15:25
And then kind of going after, or like, the positive things you have kind of gotten more into gardening. Do you think that's connected with like, COVID? And like how you've been experiencing life? Or is that just a thing you've been passionate about, like your whole life, and it just connects back?
Liz Haynes 15:39
Not my whole life. But most of my I would say that I really started gardening in my 40s. So it's something I'm thrilled about. And I'm it's something I'm looking, you know, I have found a gardener who can help me put in gardens this year. So I'm excited about those kinds of things.
Nathaniel Langner 16:00
And for the gardener, did you find the gardener pre COVID? Or did you have to find them during this time period?
Liz Haynes 16:07
Right smack in the middle.
Nathaniel Langner 16:09
Okay
Liz Haynes 16:09
I was I was at Bachmann's in Maplewood. And I ran into a very cheerful little energetic woman who, who we started talking and she started offering to, you know, for pay, of course, to come out and do some yard work and stuff like that. So I'm quite excited about having her and us building a hosta garden this year. And you coming over to see it.
Nathaniel Langner 16:37
Of course, and then going out like off of the vaccination concept. How were your feelings? Before you got the vaccine like about it? Were you worried about it? Did you think it was a positive thing? Or like something like your thought process about the vaccine in general?
Liz Haynes 16:52
I was I've never feared having the vaccine. I think people who are judgmental Yes. Instead, people who overreact and refuse that refuse to take them really need to start believing in science. You know, and I've taken for years, I've taken a flu vaccine every year. Whatever they give me if the doctor suggests it, so I was ready to take the vaccine. And because of the way it was rolled out, for the state of Minnesota, it people, lots of people got it before me. And I kept saying to Bob, "Well, come on, I had cancer last year, you shouldn't be able to get on the COVID list right away, you know". And it turned out, it turned out that as it was once they scheduled my rotator cuff surgery, they didn't want me to have the COVID shot until a week after this either a full week before or a full week after. So as it turned out, I got my first vaccination, the first Friday in February in March, excuse me.
Nathaniel Langner 18:05
Okay. And then with that did feel like kind of a weight was lifted off your shoulder like do you feel like life is a little bit more normal now?
Liz Haynes 18:15
You know, since I don't know if it matters that people know that you and I have been close for for years. Last week was the first week in 15 months that we had friends over for lunch on Friday. And we played cards. First time in 15 months. My brother and his wife stopped by on their way home from an outing on Saturday and visited to see the things we'd done in the house. And then two of my nieces the twins came over Friday. So Saturday. So in that week, we actually had six people in the house.
Nathaniel Langner 19:00
Okay.
Liz Haynes 19:00
That's the first time first time in 15 months. And, and, I guess I haven't told you I had forgotten. I've also we've also had some things done in the house things painted things fixed up. So that's been a nice distraction to through this winter.
Nathaniel Langner 19:19
Okay. And then going back to the vaccine, I guess, did you have any side effects or any like negative things after was it worth it in general?
Liz Haynes 19:29
Eight first shot was eight days after my rotator cuff surgery. And I had I was feeling every it was hard because every bump that I hit while he was driving me to the vaccine hurt and I was standing hurt and by the time I got done with it, I felt crummy. And then three weeks later, I had that same day I had my CT scan, my MRI, my follow up with my cancer surgeon on that Friday before the shot. So by the time I got home, I had a headache, and I was tired, I took a nap now, whether it was the COVID shot shot, or whether it was too much out too much. I can't tell you, but I never felt feverish or sick to my stomach or anything like that. So I think I came through it without any symptoms.
Nathaniel Langner 20:35
Okay, and then so moving off of the vaccine again. And you were talking about how now you have more people in your life being able to come over.
Liz Haynes 20:43
Yeah.
Nathaniel Langner 20:44
Previously, we talked about like, your emphasis on travel, do you feel like you can start traveling again? Or how did it influence your travel at like pre COVID, during COVID, and looking to the future, like just let's talk about traveling for a little bit.
Liz Haynes 20:58
Let's talk. Let's talk about traveling.
Liz Haynes 21:01
We you know, Nate, I love we love to travel. We had cold because of my cancer, which happened. February 4, 13th, I was diagnosed we were scheduled to leave for Thailand, about ew, seven days, 10 days after my cancer diagnosis. So that was cancelled because of cancer. Well, Bobby's birthday is in May. And we were scheduled to go to Egypt in May. And that was cancelled because of COVID. November, we were scheduled to go to Morocco. And that was cancelled because of COVID. Currently, a lot of companies are pushing travel again. But you know, you can't get into Canada. There's lots of places in like Europe that aren't aren't good. So we have a we have a trip scheduled for the Caucasus September, and it makes me a little nervous to think about going there. But I and I'm not even sure we'll make it but I am ready to go for this to be done and to go someplace. And I mean, I think everybody should go to Azerbaijan. You know, you should you should come with that to the Caucasus Nate instead of finishing school.
Nathaniel Langner 21:01
Yeah.
Nathaniel Langner 22:28
Yeah, and then going off of like the cancellation. Was it canceled? Did they cancel themselves? Or how was reimbursement? Or how was that?
Liz Haynes 22:38
Okay, we cancelled, we cancelled cancer, we canceled Thailand. And we always because we're old, we always buy insurance. Because then you just lose that, then you just lose the insurance. And so I all we lost was the cost of the insurance.
Nathaniel Langner 22:58
Okay.
Nathaniel Langner 22:58
Okay
Liz Haynes 22:58
Now, the Thailand trip, they have they have taken our money and put it on our trip to Morocco in November. So they just moved our money. Now, the scheduled trip for a for where else are we scheduled for? We have something in February that they that they moved, oh, we're Egypt, we're supposed to go to Egypt in February, and the money from Egypt was moved to Egypt. And then the money from the trip to Morocco was moved to Morocco. So when we go to when we go to the caucuses, if we go knock wood in September, we have just a downpayment on it now, so we'll have to pay. So they've kept our money and move the money to the next trip.
Liz Haynes 23:36
Which is okay with us.
Nathaniel Langner 23:52
Yeah, so that seems so without insurance, you feel like it would have been a lot different. Or,
Liz Haynes 23:58
You know, the problem is you if with trips they have they allow you to cancel with an increased loss of money and they get close. I travel insurance, they will reimburse you the whole cost, even if you just decide you don't want to go except for the cost of the insurance. So we've since I've since we've been retired, we always buy insurance today.
Nathaniel Langner 24:30
So to finalize our conversation on travel, are the your planned future trips, are those cheaper than they were previously or is the cost pretty similar?
Liz Haynes 24:41
Pretty similar. Pretty similar. And we're, we're talking about maybe, you know, I don't know if you know, I have an older sister who lives in California, and my younger brother Tom and I were talking about making a road trip to see her so we may be and if we don't do that, we may be doing a trip also to see a cousin in Florida later this late fall or early winter. But you know we we haven't driven around the country either. I miss going places Nate. Heck Nate, I miss going to Net Lake.
Nathaniel Langner 25:16
Yeah, of course it definitely has changed. So kind of going
Liz Haynes 25:20
Yeah.
Nathaniel Langner 25:20
off that did you feel like in the heart you really felt like you had to listen to science and like quarantine and stay at home. Did you buy into that or?
Liz Haynes 25:29
Oh yeah, oh yeah.
Nathaniel Langner 25:30
We're kind of starting to talk about like how that shaped you.
Liz Haynes 25:33
I bought into it about 85 90% Bob bought into to about 100 105, Bob. We just nobody could come here if they weren't wearing a mask. He didn't want anybody in the house and I I'm grateful that he was more adamant than I was about it. So yeah, we've been real sticklers.
Nathaniel Langner 25:56
Okay, and did that like, make you feel a little more secure? During like, all the uncertainty or [trails off, unknown word].
Liz Haynes 26:04
You know, I don't know if that made me more or less secure. It made me lonelier, made me feel lonelier, you know, heck, haven't gotten to see your parents. Are you very much through all of this, you know.
Nathaniel Langner 26:17
And, how was your experience with like, going to like, get groceries and other stuff when you're trying to like, protect yourself? Like, did you go at certain times? Was there a certain like, way you would do it? Did you wash your hands a lot sanitizer, masks like before masks, just stuff like that.
Liz Haynes 26:34
Um, I can tell you for me because of cancer, radiation, the surgery, the recovery from the surgery, then my rotator cuff, I have maybe gone grocery shopping, a 10th of the time that Bob has. Bob has taken over most of the responsibility for the grocery shopping so and we have hand sanitizers in both cars. When we get to wherever we're going, we make sure if the if the carts haven't been sanitized, or someone's they're not there to tell us we sanitize the cart, we wear masks. Because we're retired, we can do any do it off peak, you know, he can go shopping at 11 in the morning or one in the afternoon. And and and he does that I have my outings. Now are physical therapy, I started physical therapy four weeks after my rotator cuff surgery and I see them twice a week. Now they've all because their medical employees, they've all been vaccinated themselves. So I feel comfortable with them. But yes, they're masked, I'm masked the place the room is clean before I come in and cleaned after I leave. So yeah, I have felt safe.
Liz Haynes 26:35
Okay. And then have you had physical therapy prior to this experience?
Liz Haynes 28:05
Yeah, I do
Nathaniel Langner 28:09
And do you feel like that has, there's been like a noticeable change when you walk in to get physical therapy now like how they [unknown word].
Liz Haynes 28:23
Sure, sure. I had physical therapy after my surgery. And that's when they were beginning to in June. And so yes, they were wearing masks, but I've had physical therapy with this group be for a couple of times. So you know, you get old things fall apart, you know, and they've always been very warm and welcoming. And there were often one or two clients in the waiting room. Now they're there, nobody sits in the waiting room anymore. You walk in the door, they check you in and they put you in a in a room where you're going to have your physical therapy, so you don't and in the past, if I needed to be on a bike, like when I had my leg done, that I did a lot of biking, but they made sure the bike was clean before I sat on it and after. And that no one else was anywhere near me. If there was somebody else on a bike, we did something else, you know what I mean? So they did a lot to just make sure everybody was fine and okay.
Nathaniel Langner 29:41
Then we just talked about the ways you are protecting yourself. What were your feelings about masks in general before like mask mandate? Did you feel like they were like an important factor and you were wearing them before? Or did you wait until they were really encouraged?
Liz Haynes 29:57
No, we wore them from the beginning. I mean, every any Fauci and Mike Osterholm and, you know, people, people hear that, that we hear on the news that we're supposed to know stuff, sad, mask, wear it clean your hands keep a safe distance. So we tried to do all of those things.
Nathaniel Langner 30:20
Then you were just talking about people that know stuff. And you're at the beginning, you're talking about you kind of struggled to read stuff. How were you getting your information? Was it through like, the news? Were you reading it? And then like, kind of like, from your sources?
Liz Haynes 30:35
Well, you know, mostly, it's the news on television. I tend to sometimes I tend to watch MSNBC a little more. Anytime Fauci was on we listen to him. And, and same with Mike Osterholm. I mean, I think he's a remarkable guy. He's been, he's been the Minnesota Epidemiologist for years. And I, I've kind of listened to him for years. So mostly, we got our information through television.
Nathaniel Langner 31:12
Were you getting any information like directly from your doctors when you were going to the hospital or was it mostly just from like the news?
Liz Haynes 31:21
if we were going to the hospital, they there was always a pre, unless it was just an appointment. But if I was going to surgery, there was pre op stuff. And also the hospital would contact and say, you have to do this, this and this before you come in, you have to come by yourself or not, you have to come in by yourself, but you have to be driven by somebody. So there was a lot of information from the hospital about how, how I could come in, you know what I needed to do before I was allowed in. Same with the radiation, of 25 radiation appointments. You came into the front door, you had to stand six feet away from the person in front of you. Then you went to the front and you were met by an intake person who had a plastic shield in front of them and a face mask and plastic shield before and you were after you were checked in and your temperature was taken. Then you were sent along. And during this whole experience starting in December, I also had dental problems also went to the U and I found those same responses, you know, you have to you have to you have to temperature you before you can come in and you have to have an appointment before before they let you even even in the building. So yeah.
Nathaniel Langner 32:58
And then so with most of your medical procedures, was most of it done at the U or the University of Minnesota or did you go to other clinics?
Liz Haynes 33:08
Yeah, I would, uh, all of my cancer stuff was done at the U. The intake was there. They had the they had the, um um, sarcoma clinic there. So luckily I was they were 20 minutes away. But my rotator cuff surgery, I had the MRI and scan on it at Summit orthopedics in Badness heights. And that's where I have the surgery. And I've had physical therapy at a place called New Heights Performance, which is I don't know, but it's it's it's down 35 the south a little bit over 494.
Nathaniel Langner 33:54
But you'd say that all of your experiences were pretty much they had the same procedures of like the plexiglass the temperatures and sanitizing. Was there one that was like better than the other or were they all pretty much seemed to implement the same policies.
Liz Haynes 34:07
They did not they do. My [unknown word]. You're at that peak appointments. But they have but the women are behind the receptionists are behind the plexiglass, when they come to take you to your room. They're all masks, and you know, you stay six feet apart, but no, I, I don't. It's only at the U that I've had my temperature taken all the time.
Nathaniel Langner 34:31
Okay. And then kind of going off, like mass mandates and like temperatures, how do you feel like government responded at a state level? Do you feel like they responded adequately or did you feel like you were confused at some point or is there anything you want to add about?
Liz Haynes 34:49
I think Walz did a great job handling Minnesota. I think he was a voice of calm and reason. And I think he is Uh, I think he did a good job. You know, I'm okay with Walz. Now, if we want to get off on the national level, I think Trump turned a blind eye and made things worse rather than better. But that's, you know, that's certainly all past, you know.
Nathaniel Langner 35:19
Then going off. Sorry, I keep saying going on.
Liz Haynes 35:22
No, sure, whatever.
Nathaniel Langner 35:22
When we're talking about the calming response, do you think that was almost just as important as the policies implemented just having like a governor or a leader that you could kind of feel like, could calm or like you could trust was that just as important as the policies that were implemented?
Liz Haynes 35:40
I don't know if they were as important as the policies, because I think wearing a mask and closing down businesses and as much as as much upheaval as that created, I think was probably the most important, but it never hurts to have a calm voice saying, you know, stay calm and carry on. You know, I mean, there's nothing wrong with trying to act like Winston Churchill. So yeah, I think the fact that we had Governor Walz, and it didn't help that, that he wasn't in conflict with with the rest of government, you know, so many other states have have conflict. I mean, wasn't it Michigan, where the state of Michigan went to this to the, brought legit legislations against the female governor about closing down businesses?
Nathaniel Langner 36:43
Even in Wisconsin, the governor and the legislative and the judicial all were clashing at the same time?
Liz Haynes 36:49
Well, he did end in and it's doesn't present a united front. And you know, united front in a matter of crisis is pretty important. I think.
Nathaniel Langner 37:03
We just talked about businesses closing, were you impacted by that? Or were you just really just focused on staying home? So restaurants closing didn't really impact you? Or do you know, anyone that was really impacted by that? Like, having, [Liz begins speaking and Nathaniels audio is unintelligable for the end of this sentence].
Liz Haynes 37:18
I don't, I'm lucky enough that I don't know anybody who had lost a job. Now, I think, the closest to me about about people who were really impacted by work, were your parents. Yet, this whole thing made a big difference in in what they could do with their work. I have family members, nieces, nephews, whatever, who've worked from home, you know, been able to work from home. And there were a couple at the beginning, who were unemployed until their businesses opened back up. And one of them being my nephew is who is the manager in a dental office.
Nathaniel Langner 38:10
Okay.
Liz Haynes 38:10
And when once they opened dentistry, again, he was able to get his shots and go back to work, but knock wood, I don't know, a lot of people I don't know, anybody who's been really economically, dramatically impacted from this. And in fact, we can't spend money, we can't go out to eat, we can't travel. We ended up having a little more money this year, than we had 15 years 15 months ago, we're saving for our next trips Nate. You know, we've got our money put away for some of our next trips. But um no, I don't know, anybody who other than changing their lives not being able to see their children or their grandchildren. I don't you know, where your social life is altered? I don't know any, and you are the only person I know who has had COVID.
Nathaniel Langner 39:10
Just kind of ask. So there's closely impacted by you that had COVID
Liz Haynes 39:16
Just you know, I we had a couple of I have a couple of friends said Oh, my son has it or one of my friends. One of my friends who lives, Patti, I don't know if you've met Patti, but she lives half time in Palm Springs. Her son in law got COVID while he was visiting her I can't remember sometime in May of last March, maybe April of last year and he's one of those what did they call them the long timers? Where he's been sick and it's taken him months to recover? But I you know, personally you know you you are it buddy.
Nathaniel Langner 39:58
That's an accomplishment.
Liz Haynes 40:01
Well, I'm glad you're fully recovered.
Nathaniel Langner 40:03
Yes, I am too. Were there any policies specifically government related in the city of Little Canada that you noticed them going above and beyond? Did you have like any? Was there anything coming out Little Canada that you felt like?
Liz Haynes 40:17
Were there anything about no emails? No, nothing in the mail? No, you know, there was no city wide mailing or contacting? No, I didn't notice anything. You know.
Nathaniel Langner 40:31
And then I guess one final question relate to government, government we had there are some elections throughout the time of COVID. Did you feel Did you vote by absentee ballot? Or do you go in person?
Liz Haynes 40:45
We, we didn't go in person we did drop off. So it you know, it's not exactly absentee. But we got our ballots, and we took it down to the, the library and in in Roseville, and dropped our, dropped our ballots and voting off there. So yes, we voted.
Nathaniel Langner 41:07
If there was no COVID, would you have just when you have done the same thing? Or would you have probably just stood in line and don't like normal?
Liz Haynes 41:15
I always stand in line. The only time I've voted this way before is we were got one of the elections, we were gone somewhere. And we had to we had to put an absentee ballot in. But no, we stand in line and do our, you know, you vote we just vote.
Nathaniel Langner 41:35
And then moving towards the future. Because if I would have interviewed you six months ago or even a year, it would have been a completely different narrative. So now there's seems to be a little bit more of hope with the vaccine. Is there anything you want to add about that help there? We talked about traveling but anything else you look forward to in the future coming out of this time?
Liz Haynes 41:57
Yes. I think people over for lunch, having a having a post COVID, post cancer. See my new gardens, look at my new tapestry open house party where we can feed people and hug people and you can even have a beer at my house now that you're 21 you know, yeah, I miss I miss. I miss the socializing. I'm also I want I've been thinking seriously of volunteering at Children's Hospital. Well, I can't do that. Until all of this is settled down. So I'm, I'm hoping that get things settled down and start doing some volunteer work. Oh, I'm forgetting Net Lake. Good Lord going up to the lake and seeing people there. And you know, and why would you see I don't go to the lake because well, first of all, I haven't been well enough, but it's not like you can use it anybody. You just, you know, you're just there. So okay.
Nathaniel Langner 43:06
And then next, one of your brothers lives up towards that area. Did he kind of reiterate any like changes from like, your closer to like the city like rural and urban like how they were impacted differently? Or do you [unknown word]?
Liz Haynes 43:21
Okay, yes, he was he the only thing he is sad is that how many people in the room were in a conservative area. You know, Pine County is where half of the lake is in Pine County. And that voted, I believe they went for Trump and Carlton County, which is the other half of the lake went for, went for Biden. And he will talk about the people in Pine County, who won't wear a mask. And he he just says that he thinks that there's a more conservative bent up there, up near where the lake is, and people just, you know, don't wear masks. I think part of it is for a long time Nate, people thought they were safe if they did. Or if they lived up in Cloquet, Minnesota or up on the Iron Range. It was like they thought they were going to be safe from COVID. And I remember reading oh, at the beginning of it or hearing Fauci or, or or Michael Osterholm, your home say, you know, you guys are safe for now. But when it happens there, it will spread like wildfire there. And that's what it's done. So, you know, I don't understand people who won't wear masks.
Nathaniel Langner 44:51
Yeah. Were there any other concerns related to COVID that you want to bring up or feel like any other stories or anything you feel like it's important to share?
Liz Haynes 45:02
Well, you know, I have a passel of stories, but nothing specifically COVID. You know?
Nathaniel Langner 45:14
You feel like the vaccine will, has brought a little more positive mood to the view, do you feel like with the vaccine, we will move out of this sooner than later? Or do you feel like there's still going to be a long road ahead or a little bit in between?
Liz Haynes 45:33
I think, I think there'll be a road ahead. And I think what I found, I found really interesting, I was listening to some news report, and they talked about, I, 60 minutes, I think, had a story about how they are learning to take the virus, and within like six weeks, create, maybe I'm making up time, but within a very short period of time, determine what the virus is, and determine how to create a vaccine. So they are figuring ways that in the future, when we get other pandemics, they will have the knowledge of creating a vaccine or treatment of some sort for that. So I feel heartened by this is this has forced medicine and science to figure out how to handle something like this in the future.
Nathaniel Langner 46:30
So I know the year has been hard for you specifically and for everyone else. But going off that is there like any other bright spot that you see coming out of this? Or is it really just centered around sciences now like forced to, like confront this at a higher rate than they probably would have, and they got probably more funding than they would have without such like uh.
Liz Haynes 46:51
And I you know, I think I think I think we learned something from it now, whether it whether it will show up in my lifetime or not. I don't I don't know. You know, you can, you can I hate to sound polyamish, but you can take a situation that is difficult. And wine, which is a lot of what I did this year with my cancer and my surgery, or you can figure a way to walk through it with some humor. And I think this is really highlighted for people. You know, you turn the light on yourself. And you think well now how well did I do this? And I didn't do it very well for a lot of things. But what can I learn about it? How do I see myself and hopefully people can take this experience, myself included, and use it a lot, a little more cheerfully or optimistically?
Nathaniel Langner 47:57
Yeah, I think that's a very important thing to learn from it. There's a lot of like human character has been developed through this struggle, and not just this way.
Liz Haynes 48:06
And I think, and I think it's also been pointed out how frail and frightening how frail and frightened some people are from this experience, you know, and and hopefully we learn from it, you know?
Nathaniel Langner 48:23
And has it made you more afraid of it happening again, sooner? Or are you just glad to try and make it through this one? Or are you like is it become like, more like epidemics and pandemics? Has that become more of a topic of discussion or like on your mind than it was previously?
Liz Haynes 48:42
Do you remember? Do you remember when the E. coli was coming out of Africa?
Nathaniel Langner 48:46
Yeah, Ebola.
Liz Haynes 48:47
Not E. coli, Ebola. Yeah, they both sound similar.
Nathaniel Langner 48:52
Thats an issue.
Liz Haynes 48:53
Yes, that's true. But Michael auster home, and I brought him up three or four times. And he told me that he was the epidemiologist in Minnesota and he talked about it didn't it wasn't a matter of if it was a matter of when there would be another worldwide pandemic. That scared me kind of kind of scared the hell out of me. But now, I think of how much science has learned to create new vaccines in such a limited time span and effective vaccine vaccines and how much they've learned about mapping the, the structure of of the pandemic of the virus. I am somewhat heartened by that. You know, my complete aside and if you want to edit this out, that's fine. My mother was born in 1918. And, and that's the year that she of February of 1918, that year that that Spanish flu came along, and she was the third of four children in the family and her mother nearly died. And her mother was a young woman 30, 35 At the time, but she nearly died. And that I remember her talking to me about that. And interesting how similar this pandemic is 100 years later, you know, history repeating itself, my history major friend.
Nathaniel Langner 50:35
Yes. So through your own oral history, do you feel like we have made like any, like major changes? Or do you think it's still very similar to what happened on 100 years ago? And like, do you think we made better decisions this time around learning from the past? Or do you think we kind of repeated a lot?
Liz Haynes 50:51
You know, the things I've seen about it the good in 1918, there were a lot of people in masks, and there were people trying to get out of cities to to get away from get distancing. So it's interesting that that keeping clean, staying away, putting on a mask hasn't changed much. But the medicine has changed. You know, I mean, I don't know that. I don't know if they ever came up with a vaccine, or a treatment for that pandemic, interestingly, Nate it started in Kansas.
Liz Haynes 51:33
If you, yep, it started in Kansas with those servicemen who then went over to World War One. So I always say to Bob cam, because since he's a Kansas, you know, pandemic started in Kansas, but so I think the thing that's more optimistic is that we have medical, medical, that's much improved medical treatment and science. That's much improved. And hopefully, you know, we won't have another one in my lifetime.
Nathaniel Langner 51:33
Yeah.
Nathaniel Langner 52:11
Hopefully not.
Liz Haynes 52:12
Ones enough, you know.
Nathaniel Langner 52:15
And then I guess, starting to end this conversation, is there anything in your day to day life that you feel like you'll change? Like, you're talking about bringing people back into your home, but when you go out of your home? Is there things you like, question touching, like, you feel like, the sanitizer, or like, is there small things that you took for granted previously, that you'll kind of do differently?
Liz Haynes 52:39
I think that I think that when we when we traveled, we will be all wearing masks. I think that there will be residual mask wearing in this in this culture, I think because because I think we you know, it appears that 40 What did I see? That said something about 40% of Republican males? Were not willing to get the vaccine.
Nathaniel Langner 53:05
Yep.
Liz Haynes 53:06
Which that's a big percentage of people. You know, and and, and so, it I don't know that it'll ever be like, smallpox wiped out, or meat or polio wiped out, but we might be wearing masks for a good share of the rest of my life.
Nathaniel Langner 53:24
Okay.
Liz Haynes 53:25
You know, why do you have about you?
Nathaniel Langner 53:29
Yeah, I think there will definitely be some, like side effects or things that like, shake up our culture and start to change the world we live in. And then is there anything else you feel like you want to share before ending this conversation? Because thank you so much for taking time out of your day. And it really means a lot.
Liz Haynes 53:49
Well, I you can you can edit this to you know, almost any reason to spend an hour on the phone with you works for me.
Nathaniel Langner 53:56
Perfect.
Liz Haynes 53:57
Do you know of it? Yes, yes. Yes. And I hope you're welcome. And I hope to see you sometime this summer at the lake. Have you had your vaccine?
Nathaniel Langner 54:07
I have.