Vera Sharav Oral History, 2021/02/25

Self-description:
“I’m a child survivor of the Holocaust, so my perspective brings into the current situation a very relevant background. I find this very very difficult to acknowledge, because I never thought that I would have to speak about that in the here and now. I’ve been involved as a public advocate for ethical research in medicine. It began when my son, my older son, got sick. He got mentally ill. He had schizophrenia. So, I had to do a lot of learning about the field, what could be done to help him. I both learned, and I had to bury my son. Okay. He was put on a medication that was promised to be the end-all and be-all. It was just going to be great. It killed him. Okay. Before that, during his sickness because I had to start learning how to maneuver the mental health system, which is about as bad as it can be.”

Some of the things we discussed included:
Childhood experiences of the Holocaust.
Recent examples in American history of medical abuse and comparisions to Nazis.
Forming the Alliance of Human Research Protection.
The Nuremberg Code’s relevance today and its origins.
The importance of voluntary-informed consent.
Doctors as government agents.
Individualism vs. the greater good.
What information is necessary for “informed consent”.
Profit driven healthcare and the pharmaceutical industry.
Atrocious management of mental health/illness.
Billionaires and oligarchs, biocracy, technocracy, digital surveillance, censorship.
Not being able to see husband in a home with dementia, who died 12 April 2020 (not of COVID).
Governor Andrew Cuomo as a mass murderer for his COVID policies.
The absence of liability for doctors and nurses.
Day-to-day living as depressing and shocking.
American funding of Gain of Function Research.
Changing masking CDC guidelines: double masking, masking inside and outside, using pantyhose.
Masks as dehumanizing.
OSHA studies on masking vs. COVID policy guidelines.
Suspicion that “flu” deaths are being mislabeled as COVID-deaths, driving up the numbers.
The value of viruses to ecology.
Scientific method, the Falsification Principle, evidence, anecdotes, statistics
Small businesses
Suicides among performing artists
The difference between quarantining the sick and quarantining the healthy.
Comparisons between how the USA is handling the pandemic and COVID treatment in contrast to Tanzania and India.
A friend deciding to get vaccinated.
Taking back democracy.
Military involvement of vaccine distribution.
Losing access to methods of self-care, such as going to walks.
Living medicine-free, homeopathy.
The importance of joy.

Other cultural references include:
a 1987 article in the American Journal of Psychiatry, “L-dopa Challenge and Relapse in Schizophrenia” (https://doi.org/10.1176/ajp.144.7.934), Bayh-Dole Act, Aktion T4, Amazon, Milgram Experiment, 1918 influenza, BSE, Ezekiel Emanuel, ObamaCare, Pandemrix, iPhone, JAMA, The New England Journal of Medicine, The Lancet, George Orwell’s Nineteen-Eighty-Four (1949)

February 25, 2021 12:12

Kit Heintzman

Vera Sharav

Kit Heintzman

video

English Government Federal

English Government State

English Healthcare

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English Politics

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advocate

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conspiracy

hydroxychloroquine

ableism

activism

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Andrew Cuomo

Anthony Fauci

big government

Bill Gates

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conspiracy theories

democracy

ethics

eugenics

Fauci

fear

government

H1N1

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Holocaust Survivor

hygiene

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hydroxychloroquine

individualism

informed consent

Italy

ivermectin

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Neil Ferguson

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research

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WHO

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Over 60

05/05/2022

07/20/2022

01/13/2023

01/18/2023

03/21/2023

02/25/2021

Kit Heintzman

Vera Sharav

New York City

New York

United States of America

Video

English

01:31:27

Some of the things we discussed include:
Childhood experiences of the Holocaust. Recent examples in American history of medical abuse and comparisions to Nazis. Forming the Alliance of Human Research Protection. The Nuremberg Code’s relevance today and its origins. The importance of voluntary-informed consent. Doctors as government agents. Individualism vs. the greater good. What information is necessary for “informed consent”. Profit driven healthcare and the pharmaceutical industry. Atrocious management of mental health/illness. Billionaires and oligarchs, biocracy, technocracy, digital surveillance, censorship. Not being able to see husband in a home with dementia, who died 12 April 2020 (not of COVID). Governor Andrew Cuomo as a mass murderer for his COVID policies. The absence of liability for doctors and nurses. Day-to-day living as depressing and shocking. American funding of Gain of Function Research. Changing masking CDC guidelines: double masking, masking inside and outside, using pantyhose. Masks as dehumanizing. OSHA studies on masking vs. COVID policy guidelines. Suspicion that “flu” deaths are being mislabeled as COVID-deaths, driving up the numbers. The value of viruses to ecology. Scientific method, the Falsification Principle, evidence, anecdotes, statistics. Small businesses. Suicides among performing artists. The difference between quarantining the sick and quarantining the healthy. Comparisons between how the USA is handling the pandemic and COVID treatment in contrast to Tanzania and India. A friend deciding to get vaccinated. Taking back democracy. Military involvement of vaccine distribution. Losing access to methods of self-care, such as going to walks. Living medicine-free, homeopathy. The importance of joy.

Kit Heintzman 00:00:00
Hello, would you please start by telling me your full name, the date, the time and your location?

Vera Sharav 00:00:06
My name is Vera Serav. It is now 12:12. I'm in New York City. And it is February 25 2021.

Kit Heintzman 00:00:18
Do you consent to having this interview recorded, digitally uploaded and publicly released under a Creative Commons license attribution noncommercial sharealike?

Vera Sharav 00:00:29
Yes, I do.

Kit Heintzman 00:00:31
Would you please start by introducing yourself, tell me and historians of the future anything you would like us to know about you and the place that you're coming from in this conversation?

Vera Sharav 00:00:44
I'm a child survivor of the Holocaust. So my perspective, brings into the current situation, a very relevant background. I find this very, very difficult to acknowledge. Because I never thought that I would have to speak about that in the here and now. I've been involved as a public advocate for ethical research in medicine. It began when my son my oldest son got sick, he got mentally ill, he had schizophrenia. So I have to do a lot of learning about the field about what is going on what could be done to help him. and I both learned and had to bury my son. Okay. He was eventually put on a medication that was promised to be the end all and be all it was just gonna be great. Right? It killed him. Okay. Before that, during his sickness, because I had to start learning how to maneuver in mental health system, which is about as bad as it can be. One of the things that I received in the mail was an article in the American Journal of Psychiatry. And it was about a clinical trial on 28 veterans at the Bronx, VA. Who had been living in the community. Seven of them were actually the researcher said they were currently not ill so they were in total revision. The researchers brought them into the hospital, took them off whatever therapies they were on, gave them L dopa and sent them off into the community. L dopa causes psychosis. So, and sure enough, all 28 suffered a psychotic relapse. I was so shocked reading this, I read it in I think 92 1992 Something like that. It was written in 87 I was really horrified. I called a doctor psychiatrist who I knew at Long Island Jewish, John Kane. I remember and I and I asked him Am I reading what I'm reading? You read it and he said Yes you are I said this is like the Nazis. They purposely cause psychotic relapse in these veterans. So I searched around and found that there is such a thing as the Federal Office of Human Research protection and I filed a complaint and from then on, you know, eventually formed organization. First one, serve care and with a doctorate George George Washington University, she was professor there. And she died in the NEC formed the Alliance for human research protection, which I invite people to come and look at because that's where my work is. is mainly to be found, not only I've done some publications as well. But I've devoted really a good part of my adult life trying to do to have the Nuremberg Code followed those 10 commandments, I call them the 10 commandments, because that's what they are, unlike every other ethics document, the Nuremberg Code cannot be changed. It's part of a legal decision.

Vera Sharav 00:05:45
It's been cited by judges in the United States several times. I just happen to be involved in both of them. Two do that. I know one in New York, and one in Maryland. The point is, this is both the human rights and legal right first of all, voluntary informed consent, and it says is absolutely essential. And then it goes on, to provide various grades of what needs to be what constitutes ethical research. And they point out one of the, one of the 10 principles is, if there is any possibility of serious harm or death, it cannot be done except possibly on the researchers themselves. Okay. It's pretty specific, it's pretty plain, you cannot do research that will harm a person. And then, of course, you're supposed to disclose, whatever, you know, anyway, this, this job that I took upon myself, unfortunately, is, you know, it's forever. Because the violations, unfortunately, you see, doctors in the United States didn't think that the Nuremberg Code was really anything for them to be bothered about, because this was only for the barbaric Nazi doctors. Unfortunately, what I have found what I battle against, is that when doctors when medicine joins government, that's where the trouble starts. Like medicine joins government, the Hippocratic Oath gets sort of swept aside, first do no harm to the individual. That Hippocratic Oath is a personal responsibility that the doctor swears to uphold but when a doctor becomes a government agent, that no longer applies, what happens then is that he start thinking about the greater good. Well, the greater good is a very vague, nonspecific can't hold anybody to it. It means nothing. Because it's just a way of saying something for the greater good. It sounds more important. No, it's not. The individual is the important one, you harm an individual, you're harming society. So I've taken on as you can see, you know, very powerful entrenched powers stay I mean, its take on government and public health. And we are now confronted with huge issues in public health. Does, you know, does the government have a right to take away our personal individual rights or human rights to make decisions for ourselves as far as what medicines we want, what we don't want.

Kit Heintzman 00:09:35
I'm curious, could you speak a bit more about how you're understanding individual healthcare decisions and individual health care consumers and sort of structural policy? So the Nuremberg Code is a kind of policy that you're referencing, but there's also a strong theme of autonomy in what you're saying. So could you talk to me a bit about how those work together?

Vera Sharav 00:09:59
Well, You know, it's interesting. I've done a lot of research also about the Holocaust and about how how, how did it happen in the most advanced society at the time? Germany was the model. Okay. And and it's in medicine in particular, I mean, American doctors went to get postdoctoral education in Germany, in the 30s. So, how did that happen? I mean, there have been many books written, trying to figure out how did that happen? Well, the interesting not all that long ago, I found the source for the Nuremberg Code, really. And it was a Dr. Solomon, who was horrified when a vaccination of babies in Germany killed 70 babies. The two doctors, by the way, who administered the tainted vaccine, were tried for murder. Dr. Solomon then wrote up a set of ethical principles. The first one was, of course, do no harm, but he also included voluntary informed consent. And these principles were actually distributed by the government. But then, of course, the Nazis did away with it. And he they sent him to today's to start where he died. But his document was a cornerstone of the Nuremberg, he also understood that the doctors responsibility includes giving full information not dictating, but allowing the person to have autonomy and decide.

Kit Heintzman 00:12:17
May I ask what kind of information you think people need in order to have an informed consent on the kinds of issues you're discussing?

Vera Sharav 00:12:27
Now, yeah, informed consent, first of all. It's, it's very disturbing, really, how sloppy informed consent really is, and the documents that are given to people pretending that they're disclosing either they are so lengthy, and so, you know, boilerplate kind of documents, nobody can read that, really, I can't either. I mean, that's not the point. And of course, they put great emphasis on the little needle stick. You know, that's, that's not the point. What needs to be is relevant information that the doctors themselves would want, if they were going to be in the study. You know, I really don't think there should be a difference. And a person should be able to take the document though the informational consent form to a lawyer if they want, you know, just like you would if you go to buy a house, you need a an expert, who is distanced who has no financial or professional interest in the trial, unfortunately, now more and more, particularly since 1986, the by DOE law, which eliminated the division between academia and industry that changed science and medicine to a great degree, because pharmaceutical industry and biotech all that is what is putting the pressure on to get things done fast so that the profits can come rolling. And what the Bydo law did was encouraged public private partnerships. That means they're there, you know, you've got the corporate government. And you that's not exactly a fair scale, would you say? And that's what's really happened more and more. And, of course, if you see a, if there's some sort of a crisis, well, then everything gets thrown. loan to the wind. And people as individuals don't count. It's very dangerous. This is a very dangerous time that we're living in. This is not a you know, I don't think that enough people recognize how serious our whole civilization is really right now, because the technology is there to destroy, you know, remotely. It can do it with a clicker. It really can it. One of the factors also that ties in the Nazi period is that they also were very, very in awe of technology. And the Holocaust was the first and only industrialized mass murder. I mean, that's what it was, it was an industrial kind of thing. And industry was very much involved. That's the other thing. Of course, the medical professional were the main criminals. That's that's what the Nuremberg trial was about. Except that, of course, it was more than those particular individuals, the whole medical establishment was involved.

Kit Heintzman 00:16:27
[Both speaking] I have a related question that sort of harks back to something you had said earlier, you had spoken about your experiences with the medical field with your son and schizophrenia, as well as sort of a history of the structural of change is of medicine changing over the 20th century, I'm wondering if you would be able to share a little bit about your own personal so not proxied, through a family member experiences with the healthcare system and how those have shaped your trust.

Vera Sharav 00:17:02
I. Well, as I said, with my son, I knew about mental health, which is absolutely atrocious. It's below, plus the fact that it's a field where the doctors really have no empathy, no respect for their own patients. And those patients are often forced, even by courts, to take medications that then absolutely devastate them. So in that area, it's really, it's the worst. Because the patients are disqualified as human beings. And in fact, legally, they can't even testify or anything if they were abused, who believes crazy. That's, that's, that's a fact. So we've got several tiers of medical care. You know, this was supposed to be a classless society, oh, boy, are we learning about class, right? That's just it. You see, the human species is what it is. And there are there are real evil people. And unfortunately, they often rise to the top. They get there by crimes, and their crimes only get larger, greater in scope, because they get more power. I mean, wealth and power go together. And most of these billionaires, the oligarchs, now that we have, you know, created just in these last 25 years, but they're completely without morals. They truly believe that they are ever mentioned. They absolutely do. They are certain that they are because they're smarter than everybody else, you see, and they got to have $110 billion. That's the latest figure for Bill Gates $110 billion. And the rest, you know, become less and less consequential and in fact, they want to robotized everything anyway. Do away with people. So as far as other medical issues My husband was the love of my life. died just last April. No, he did not die with COVID. Up But he, he had dementia. And with my experience with my son, which I never forgave myself of having kind of helped to push the drug on him, because that's what the experts recommended, right? I listened to the experts at that time. And that was a big mistake. With my husband throughout, and he lived with this for 14 years. I kept that stuff away. I did not. We tried. Initially, you know, we tried the most in our separate whatever, but whatnot. So it didn't do any good, we stopped it. We tried a lot of other things, too, all kinds of supplements, we went through a whole, whatever there was, to try no stone unturned. But since it didn't, and I have been in touch with various doctors, not just as treating ones, including actually the doctor who had developed our stuff. And he told me forget it. So he lived. And he was in an assisted living home. And now you know, when confronted with the horror of the nursing homes, and Governor Cuomo, there's really, there's risk by Imagine a mass murderer, he bears responsibility for about 15,000 deaths, who sent death warrants. So what I can say is that my husband's doctors, one and then another one, they each told me, because I have kept all the medical stuff away from you. That's why he was alive. And each stage of the illness and this is a very [phone ringing] relentless illness, you know. Of course, it's nothing. [phone ringing]

Vera Sharav 00:22:29
Marketing. You know, it's, it's an extremely, extremely sad thing to witness to, especially with a person that you love more than anything. But I will say that he, as long as you know, as he could, he kept his dignity, you know, and was reasonably happy. He died though. April 12. And it was three weeks that I couldn't see him, and he couldn't see me that, you know, that helped to push it. But he was ready to go. And since then, the this whole year, I thank God, that he was not alive for all this. You know, the masking just began, but he was really retreating. He was he was dying. And, and I was with him. They did. They did let me come. So it was within the last two days. So he didn't die long. But you know, seeing what's going on. I don't know how many of your researchers and whoever will be looking at this. Know, actually how the Holocaust started. Didn't start with the Jews. The first victims of the Holocaust, were babies and children under the age of three. If they had any kind of disability, imperfection. Midwives, nurses reported them to the government. And then doctors selected the children for debt. But that's not what they told the parents. When they came to take the parents they told them that they would take the children for special treatment, they would get special treatment for their health. The children were killed. With injections, lethal injections like some children were even subjected to torture experiment calibrated starvation experiments. So the doctors could record how long the baby could live without nourishment. And then the parents were given deaths certificates death certificates they not fake news fake death certificates are not something new, they did that. And it was signed by doctors telling them children died of natural causes. The next in line with the mentally ill. It was called the oxygen t four t four just for a an address. And then it came to the nursing homes, the long term care facilities, all of these were deemed by doctors to be worthless eaters, unfit for life.

Vera Sharav 00:26:27
That's what I see happened with nursing homes. And not only here, but in Europe as well, Western Europe. Now this is also very disturbing. The murder, the cleaning out of nursing homes occurred in the most in the wealthiest, most developed countries in the world. The third world doesn't really think about that one. Sweden [both talking] Belgium

Kit Heintzman 00:26:57
Can I ask you. And so when you're talking about the clearing out of the nursing homes, you're talking about our contemporary moment in COVID.

Vera Sharav 00:27:05
I'm talking about Yes, about not treating patients in nursing homes. And what we had that was what happened in Europe. And what happened here in New York and a couple of other states, but New York was the central you know, the Ground Zero, they called it right. Governor Cuomo actually signed the death warranty. He forbade hospitals from treating elderly with COVID. And he ordered nursing homes to accept them in the knowledge that, as he put it himself, in his words, this pandemic in nursing homes will be like fire through dry grass, fire through dry grass. And then he signed in dem he indemnified, both hospitals and nursing homes. And only that and that indemnification was hidden. It was hidden in a massive budget bill, so that legislator has had no idea that immunity was given. And one has to really, this is evil. This isn't with knowledge, because he himself said he knew that it would just they would die like dry grass.

Kit Heintzman 00:28:56
Again, a clarification question when you say What do you mean when you say immunity was given?

Vera Sharav 00:29:02
in the in the law in the law that was passed the budget law, there is a section a small section, which is to say, you know, it's it was buried in there, that the debt there would be no liability for hospitals, or nursing homes for any harm done to them

Kit Heintzman 00:29:25
I'd like yo pivot, if possible to some questions that bring us closer to some of those sort of more experiential aspects of COVID-19 and what it's like to live now for you. Would you be willing to tell me a bit about what your day to day is looking like post 2020?

Vera Sharav 00:29:53
It's very disturbing. It's very depressing. And it's shocking. It's shocking. For me to see I live in the center of New York City. I live next door to Lincoln Center. Everything is perfect. I mean, there's there's nothing going on right there. No culture is no culture, schools are. This is a travesty, and it is a crime against humanity. That's how I'm seeing it this is a crime against humanity. Why is there suddenly a war against all of us? Well, there, you know, eugenics is the poison underneath it.

Kit Heintzman 00:30:48
Can you tell me when you say, Why is there a war against all of us? Who is the US? Who is the war against?

Vera Sharav 00:30:53
All of us in all of us insignificant people who don't run things. There are those who are in fact running things in the universe. Yeah. World Economic Forum, World Health Organization, to International Bank. I mean, they decide things that we then live with. And for whatever, I don't know how this virus started, there are, there are lots of people who are investigating it. You know, it came out of China that much we know from Wuhan. We know that we, the United States, actually, Fauci paid them three and a half million dollars, even when there was not supposed to be for research. That's called gain of function. Now gain of function. Research is precisely experimenting with various pathogens, viruses, bacteria, to make them more potent, gain a function. I mean, it's lethal. This is biological warfare kind of stuff, which we're not supposed to be doing right. So that's why I say it's a war because if this isn't how, yeah, and again, medicine is being weaponized. And that's what I've railed against, as far as that's what the Nazis, did. They weaponize medicine, everything was done with doctors and white coats, doing all the selections, doing the plans, the criteria, everything. It gave the veneer of some legitimacy, you see. And that's, that's what I'm seeing now. So how is it? Psychologically, it's, it's very depressing. Now in New York, we really it's depressing to walk in the street and people everybody is in masks. I won't wear a mask outside, you know, you need oxygen, not carbon dioxide, indoors, you know, to protect this. Fine, but outdoors, it's insane. Now, we're being told double masks and the new CDC director actually said pantyhose to hold the mask. It was carried by all the major media I have to tell you, at first I thought, well, this is ludicrous. No. What will they think of next? Why are people going like, like the herd, the herd of sheep?

Kit Heintzman 00:33:42
May I ask what it is, in particular, you find depressing when you see people in the streets wearing face masks?

Vera Sharav 00:33:49
Well, the dehumanizing thing. In other words, you people aren't relating to each other. And that's what these things are doing. None of the see none of these steps that they're telling us to follow, whether it's masks, whether it's physical distancing, which is called social distancing. You none of those things have any scientific validity, and they know it. There have been studies that have also had lots of studies about masks and how and what one should wear, and you're not supposed to do what we're being told to do. So it has other ramifications. Other Other uses and schools closed children are not at risk of COVID but the schools are closed. Every country does things a little differently. So there are two you could see this is not science based. You know, and as we remember, at first the panic the fear that has gripped you know the world about this virus was caused by faulty modeling. From the two universities, the Imperial College and Washington Univrsity of Washington. I mean, they've been wrong. A lot, but they are relied on as being the authority. We were good as leaders of the world were terrified when they were told that we were supposed to two and a half million. I mean, we're, it's bad enough. But then there's another thing. issue about trust totally of trust. One of the things that came out with Cuomo is that they conceal the numbers. He concealed the numbers. That should give us all a clue. Yes. Politicians will do that. They will fake the numbers to suit their agenda. The same thing is happening with the numbers, how come this year there is no flu deaths? What happened? We had them every year. I suspect, okay, since I don't have they were nicely put into COVID. So that we should continue to be frightened and continue to wear masks. Viruses will come and go, you know, I mean, that's nature. In fact, I read one thing, I'm not a scientist, of course, but But I tried to educate myself. If they had it their way, and we would be totally without, you know, viruses, that would be the end of the world. We have to have viruses, we have to have all kinds of, you know, our, our gut tests to.

Kit Heintzman 00:37:04
Sorry, our follow up questions. When you say something isn't based on science, or isn't scientific evidence? Would you tell me what it is about the scientific method that you value that you don't see happening here? What is it, that science is that this is failing to be?

Vera Sharav 00:37:22
Genuine science is always asking questions and actually arguing against whatever the current theory is, it's supposed to be to test in order to invalidate what is now considered, you know, authority, and that's how it keeps on growing and, and improving. When you have dictates, you know, the word science by authorities, and you must not question that. Watch out, that means something is being brought, something's being covered up something that they don't want scientists to alter. They've got too much invested in it. That's unscientific. Also scientists, you see, again, before, before, the bipedal law, scientists, you know, the academy was really separate that it wasn't a profit motive there. It was really science. That changed radically. They became partners and patented. I mean, the government scientist who salaries we pay, they also have patents, and they're also making that kind of money. I mean, it is it has been corrupted in essentially, every part of it.

Kit Heintzman 00:38:56
I'd like to move back into sort of questions about personal experience. You spoke a little bit about what those restrictions have been in New York, can you talk about how they have changed how you move around in the city, how how sort of the daily life has changed in relationship to restrictions on their personal impact on you.

Vera Sharav 00:39:16
I have taken a few walks you know, like 30 Block kind of walks to see what it is what what has happened is that the local small businesses are totally gone. Restaurants are holding you know by the skin of their teeth. Of course, once it got cold, it became more of a problem because it was supposed to be outside and all that even though they've never found never shown that restaurants were spreaders of disease. Getting rid of the local means that first of all, of course, it's a horror in terms of financial economic burden. That people now have bankruptcies. So that's the owners of those shops, shoe repair, I mean, you know, all service people, you know, you dealt with people you interacted that is what is being denied, don't want us to interact, and they want us to buy everything from Amazon. And he's made trillions during this COVID I mean, some $4 trillion were made by those oligarchs. So for them this has been a bonanza is actually make people furious. Instead their waiting for the next order. What can we please? I mean, this subservience is what I'm shocked. Especially you know Americans. Americans were always so who the hell cares? What Europe, you know, we're doing we're doing better. We're [makes sound]. Right. I mean, that was that was the ethos. It's gone. At least in New York. And it's ironic because New York was even some had suggested as if we weren't even part of America, right? We were all a whole bunch of foreigners here. It is extremely sad to see the, again, sort of reenactment the validation, you know, for the Milgram studies? You know? It's not only that you could get people to torture others. But you could get people to do things. You could get people to become the, the slaves. And that's, that's what is so shocking.

Kit Heintzman 00:42:03
So if I'm understanding your answer, about the personal experience of restrictions, most of your answers framed in terms of witnessing so you're seeing these restrictions happening, you find mask wearing depressing. You think it's sad that businesses are going out. Would you describe that as sort of the extent of your contact with the restrictions that the restrictions are something you are witnessing or do you feel like you're also living any of them?

Vera Sharav 00:42:31
Well, I am I can't travel. You know? And that was that was a pleasure. You know? I can't go to concert I can't go to Museum Of course my life is it you know, yeah. Luckily, you know, I live in a nice apartment. And I have you know, and I have good views so I can you know, I have a bit more but I I feel terrible for people who are really locked in, let's say with three kids running in, in a sick mother in law and it is horrific. The mental health of society now is absolutely in shambles. The suicides I can't tell you for example, friend who musician who lives in a building on 42nd street that is just for it's meant for artists. Actually, originally it was built for Highland but at that time Times Square was not somewhere where people you know could afford that would live so they they wound up giving it you know, subsidized sort of for artists he left for the time being is in a trailer someplace upstate, whose people were jumping out of windows. What happens to performing artists no jobs, no livelihood that's you know I, I remember you during the Iraqi invasion, I remember this one woman I think it was the New York Times Magazine had a big spreader. And she looked at everybody said, What have you done? What have you done? Okay, that's how I feel.

Vera Sharav 00:44:35
What has been done? You know, even in the 1918. Influenza, they didnt close down the world. This is all wrong. You're supposed to quarantine the sick. Instead, we'll quarantine the healthy and making everybody hopefully sick. I mean, this is crazy. You know, the Javits Center and the big military ship, they were never used. It was a lie. In other words, sure, there were people who were dying. And certainly they didn't know how to treat them. At first, they put everybody on ventilators, so they killed them. And why? Why is that? Why does united states ban drugs treat, that do treat and to cure theyre used elsewhere? How come there aren't all these deaths in India and Tanzania in Africa, they're using all the cheap drugs, and they're fine. And I'm talking about drugs that are actually licensed by the FDA, you know, and have been used for decades and decades. So obviously, there's a safety record. But suddenly, we're not allowed to use it. Why?

Kit Heintzman 00:46:02
Could you tell me which drugs in particular you see, well prohibitions against and where are those prohibitions coming from?

Vera Sharav 00:46:10
hydroxychloroquine ivermectin. And there are a whole lot of antivirals. Now, there are so many people are testing them. And it's Yeah, and it's the government that doesn't suddenly, again, this, this is the way it worked in Germany, the government is dictating the practice of medicine. Doctors are rebelling, there were doctors, that frontline doctors, American frontline doctors and a few others doctors for informed consent. And of course, many of the doctors on our advisory board. And all over the world. There are 1000s of doctors who have signed petitions. To yes, to be free to to to practice their professional judgment. That's what we go to a doctor for is for their professional judgment. I don't go to a doctor to you know, for CDC, they never treat patients, those bureaucrats Come on. Here's a big difference. And they're contaminating medicine. No. That's a terrible thing.

Kit Heintzman 00:47:24
What do you remember about when you first heard about COVID-19? What do you remember about the kind of information that came to you at the beginning?

Vera Sharav 00:47:37
Well, the first thing that I remember was the the projection, the projection, is that why we have to lock down and all of that sort of thing, why we have to be under house arrest. And that came Niall Ferguson at the Imperial. I did some research others have done my God, he has been wrong every single time. He was the one that caused them to the slaughter, I don't know a million sheep. Each time, these viruses. This is so so why is he still the authority there? He's the head of the department of the modeling department. Clearly the models is not exactly reliable. So why, but he scared the daylights out of everyone, including Trump at the time. Who doesn't scare easily, you know, but yeah, he was two and a half million. I got it. Oh my god. You know, let's do it fast. So it was I remember that I and then there were different. Of course, what was very disturbing was the Bergamo deaths in Italy. Since then, doctors have figured out what, what caused that. And it turns out that in that region, in Italy, in particular, they they had a particularly strong flu vaccine that they got, it wasn't the same one that was used here. And that it's in medicine that there are you know, it's complicated. Vaccines aren't so simple. And it crept sort of that when they were exposed to this virus, it just destroyed them. So that was one you know, one of the reasons but as as I said, all of your was really using the opportunity. And I I don't know if that was all in you know, collusion or each one to say this is a way to get rid of the burden of Well, yeah, the Germans called them useless eaters, but essentially non unemployed. And we've got that we've got, we've got you Genesis, such as that in government, establishing policy, absolutely public policy.

Vera Sharav 00:50:25
Ezekiel Emanuel is he's written books about yeah, triaging and you know, who by setting value and human beings, okay. And he sets the highest value on adolescents and young adults, children and the elderly. least he has said, people with dementia should not get basic medical care. Okay, this is a Jew, a medical doctor. And the [inaudible]. And he, he was the architect of Obamacare. We have to really you know

Kit Heintzman 00:51:15
Would you tell me what health means to you?

Vera Sharav 00:51:17
Health?

Kit Heintzman 00:51:19
Yes

Vera Sharav 00:51:19
What health means? Health means what for one thing, it means not being sick. But what. But what it also means is being kind of in in balance with one's environment with nature, health means both psychological health and physical health, the two really are connected. Again, human body is not really just a bunch of protoplasm. And, you know, and they know because they're one of the problems. In Germany, they call it by accuracy. Okay. We now with advance to technocracy but essentially, it's very connected. It's regarding human beings as mere biological, you know, things that have cells and they have things and they have this and that, but, but there's no there's no. What used to used to be religion, which now they're very few, like, something like that hasn't really been replaced. We haven't replaced religion with others. So it's, people haven't been really healthy in feeling good. For a long time, I think that's, that's one of the things that so so unfortunate, because even people who have means doesn't mean that they've been healthy, happy, healthy. [talking over wach other]

Kit Heintzman 00:53:18
What are some? What are some of the things that you would like for your own health and for the health of others around you?

Vera Sharav 00:53:30
I think for one thing, health does not mean that you have to have medicine, a lot of natural homeopathic a lot of that works. And mostly it's not addictive. One of the major problems that elderly people have, and although, you know, the calendar says I'm among them, but I'm not, I don't take anything, nothing. Okay. Absolutely nothing, my body takes care of things. My I want to make sure that my immune system is good. So I listened to those who directly in that direction, you see, rather than resorting to the chemicals and I think people need to one of the things that, you know, the founding fathers expected was that the popular population would be intelligent, would be able to make decisions. And that's exactly, you know, when people are productive when people feel they have that they that they're in charge of the ancient right of their own lives. That gives you a sense, yeah. That gives you a sense of well being And what is really shockingly, what is happening now under this COVID Is that people have suspended using their own judgment. They don't want to bother to do a little research. I mean, not everything is fun to read, you know, some of it's pretty boring. No. But you do it and then, you know, you're, you need to be able to make judgments. And if you can't make them one of the things, and that's been documented, that when people don't have choice, when people are displaced, they get very depressed and very agitated.

Kit Heintzman 00:55:48
How do you think we could attain as a culture, the vision of health that you want? What we need to change and concrete things that you think are sort of actionable?

Vera Sharav 00:56:02
Well, I think that as I say, What's action is really to start breathing oxygen. That's the first thing, take off the masks and say no. Outside, there's absolutely no justification. And, and the authorities, I mean, they've changed from the in the beginning, oh, no, don't be silly masks. Oh, well, if it makes me feel better, that was Fauci talking. And then the next thing, you know, he now says, oh, through 2022, we're going to have that masks whether you're vaccinated or not. So then what the heck, isn't that enough to depress you? I mean, in other words, it was originally supposed to be for two weeks remember, when they first said. No this is people need to take responsibility. So for example, friends who we discuss these things, obviously. And one said, no, she said, Okay, I will take the vaccine, because I, you know, my daughter is in Chicago, my son is I want to be able to travel, she said, I know, I dread I listened and I think it'll make sense. But for my few years, I don't know how much I have. I would, that means more. I said, Fine. That's exactly what you're supposed to do is decide yourself. And that's what I want. I want people to take responsibility, and make their own decisions. Now some decisions that will make maybe wrong, but God dammit. Public health decisions have been so bad for so many viruses. Remember that? The H1N1 and we've had a lot. We've had one after the other. They were disasters. {Kit talking in background] And then the public went away. You know, they went away by themselves. That's what eventually happened, because the vaccines were no good. And all the things that they told us didn't happen.

Kit Heintzman 00:58:06
Would you tell me which public health policies in relationship to H1N1 you saw as disastrous?

Vera Sharav 00:58:14
There was, yeah, they had the World Health Organization announced the pandemic independent. And it never really happened. It was you know, there was once in 1976. It was in 209. There was in 211. You know, each time they tried to scare people, but it didn't really work this time. It worked.

Kit Heintzman 00:58:35
Understanding correctly.

Vera Sharav 58:37
In other words. Yeah, what we were told to do, we were supposed to be it was, these were all experimental kinds of vaccines. And they had one of the vaccines for example, it cause nacro lepsy, especially in adolescence. It was horrific.

Kit Heintzman 00:58:56
Would you explain what that means?

Vera Sharav 00:58:59
Sleeping Sickness can't wake up, can't stay awake. And tons of it was bought me part of this, this has to do with In other words, what used to be the tail has become the ruling thing. In other words, we now if you've got if you've got a, you know, a truckload of vaccines or whatever drug you've got to get rid of, it's got sell fast you know, you've got to get the profit before it's found out that it's actually doing more harm than good. Because then you can sell it but in the beginning, wow.

Kit Heintzman 00:59:39
What does safety mean to you?

Vera Sharav 00:59:41
Safety in in what relation okay, because that's the look, I live on the 28th floor. So for some people that's not safe you know, if you have what do you call it? Oh, on dirt vertigo, that wouldn't be good, right? For me, it's wonderful, you know, because I like, but So depends what you mean safety, what, in relation to medicine or in relation to life?

Kit Heintzman 01:00:13
I mean, sort of holistically, if you were to think about the kinds of things that make you feel safe. What are those things? What is the experience of safety like?

Vera Sharav 01:00:23
Well, part of it really has to do with people around you also being, you know. Look, human, humans need to socialize, they need to be with people. Some people need less, some people more, but altogether, a friendly atmosphere. Where people say, Hello, smile, you know, how are you? Oh, that's a nice hat or something like that? Yes, those things matter. Being recognized, you go to the, you know, to a restaurant many times, and Oh, hello, how are you? You know, Vera, you know, that sort of thing? Community. Okay. This is what's being destroyed. And I believe that is being destroyed with on purpose. They want to detach us from our, from the things that yes, that make us feel strong and healthy and happy. They want us to be dependent. I'm very, very concerned about the, you know, the government making people dependent on them for their basics, instead of going to work, there will be getting government checks, that eventually doesn't work too well, because then government controls. And there is, you know, there are hints already about everything moving to electronic, which means surveillance and controlling. In other words, it's not China is probably way ahead. And suddenly, China the most today, you know, the most autocratic society, and we were being it's being held up to us as we should emulate, like theChinese. Then

Kit Heintzman 01:02:28
Can you tell me who's proposing that. That we emulate.

Vera Sharav 01:02:31
Oh, that was oh, Anthony Fauci holy said, oh, yeah, that Chinese Oh, you see, but but our administration now, that's not, that's not the kind of society we want. And there are, there are quite a few videos even showing just how you know, all this, the shield masks, and then the one digit card, the card that has everything on it, that's what they want to do that we should have both our banking, our health, record everything on that. It'll be either either a card, you know, like a credit card, or it'll be chipped in ours. Under Our Skin. I'm sorry, I would rather die than live in a society like that. That's not life. And I know what under life is. I've been there. I don't want that. And I'll tell you, I will tell you Well, alright. You ask your questions. As you said, at the end, I can add something right. Okay, go ahead.

Kit Heintzman 01:03:37
Absolutely.

Vera Sharav 01:03:38
Am I being a good girl? (laughing) I mean,

Kit Heintzman 01:03:40
That is not mine to decide I am not the adjudicator of anyone's virtue. I'd like to ask how you're feeling about the immediate future, and what you'd like for the long term future?

Vera Sharav 01:03:59
Well, I'd like I'd like our freedom back. I'd like to be able to, to go where I please when I please. I'd like to be I'd like to have society back with freedom, and my human rights and my dignity. All these things. Also, I didn't mention it before but it's obvious. It's very undignified that taking our dignity away but telling us how many feet which should be in one place it's three feet in the other place it six feet and obviously it has no connection to any evidence of value. And masks now as I said, you two masks plus pantyhoes, I mean, what next? What all those things are really Yes. They are demonizing. I mean, it used to be, you know, in China where they were the one uniform Right, everybody was in black and whatever Mao said, that's how it was. And that's what they want us to do. I think that I think that there was a lot of preparation for this. People got very addicted, number one to the iPhone. It's an addiction for many in total reliance in a lot of the, you know, banking by phone this by phone everything but well, in the meantime, we've collected a lot of data, and all of us. And data is the most valuable resource for these oligarchs, because they're running the show. It's the tech. And they're running it together with government, you know, they get credit for, you know, Gates with Microsoft and Google. It's the government that first developed those technologies, and they essentially gave it to them to become billionaires. But with the proviso that they provide most of the data to the government. Okay, so you've got the two together, and they're an email and everyone got so addicted to the phone, really, it's amazing. I give it up in a minute. I know we can't, in many ways, go back and we're doing something electronically right now I know. And, of course, the internet. But the other thing is, I don't want to be censored. I don't want to have information censored. That makes me very unhappy. We now need a Samizdat. Samizdat with the underground information source that people in the Soviet Union used to rely on because they didn't trust correctly. They didn't trust the government. There's a joke where the husband comes in, he sees the wife was typing away typing. And this was during the time you had to mimeograph things and all that before the tech stuff. And she said, This is what do you typing? She's tell us war and peace. He said, Why do you have to try born and peace it's a book. She said, Are you kidding? Your son wouldn't believe a word of it? I have to type it then he'll believe it? So that's No, really. Because those same oligarchs own the internet run, you know, they can help to censor everything now is fake. Now, it's not first of all, we should each be able to decide what's fake and what's not. In what we want to believe in what we don't want to believe that is our right. But they're taking that away. They're deciding they're the censors. fact checkers. That is that's the, again, whatever the terminology that gets invented, it's always the opposite of what's actually being done. That's, that's always we're from the government, we're here to help you.

Kit Heintzman 01:08:26
Is it fair to say that part of what you're arguing for is a total freedom to model of speech? Freedom of speech is completely total, there is nothing that can't be said.

Vera Sharav 01:08:44
I would censor is child pornography. And that's not censored. Okay. That's a big business. That's a very big business. So it's child trafficking. Okay. That's kind of stuff that I would draw the line. But ideas. There's no such thing as dangerous ideas. There are only dangerous people.

Kit Heintzman 01:09:06
May I ask what some of the things you've been doing to take care of yourself? In the last year? How may I ask what some of the ways that you've been taking care of yourself have been over the last year? It's been a hard year on everyone. And everyone's had to develop strategies for managing this moment? What have been some of yours?

Vera Sharav 01:09:27
No, actually, I have neglected doing what I've done before, which was take really good long walks, you know, four miles in the morning. That and even though I need it, and I know it would be so much better for me, and I always feel good. If I take a long walk, and you know, I don't jog, but I walk. And I haven't done it and partly it's, you know, it's depressing to constantly in other words, In my own home, I'm sort of removed from all that on what's going on. But going out, yeah, and it really is very, it's sad to see so many people, you know, some of them really elder shuffling along, and with the massive Walker and a this, you know, so many things. Everybody, you know, everybody is just in fear. I feel like we have to open the curtain, you know. It's, I, it's not, it's not really possible to be happy, in a very unhappy community.

Vera Sharav 01:10:49
I feel that we're in a precipice, that unless people rebelled and take back our democracy, and our life, the way we want to live it, it will all be lost. It's happened in other cultures. It's just Americans don't appreciate history. American American history has two years ago, it really don't, they're not taught to respect the fact that if that happened, it could happen. And that the way to avoid it is by studying how and what factors led it to happen. Without really without history, we then lose our part of a very important part of our humanity, because memory and history I think, are things that humans have. We are not like animals, we're not. Some animals have a little bit more traits. Sure. But it only goes so far. And we're the ones that write history, right. And, unfortunately, especially in the 20th century, we sometimes we've had to wait 50 to 60 years to get the full truth.

Vera Sharav 01:12:16
And a lot of things are embargoed. Under the [inaudible] security, [inaudible]. You know, I mean, the United States has laws that really, CIA is not supposed to set foot on any American now. Now, it you know, everything is being done through the militaries involved in the distribution of the vaccines. I mean, the whole thing is taken on a military. And I just read, it was a whistleblower in Germany. You know, nursing home. And he described what, how, when they came with soldiers in uniform, to the nursing home to get the vaccine. I mean, how intimidating that was. And for those people who said they still remember. Yeah. So it's, wrong the elderly, like, is it there? You know, that'd [inaudible] Osama bin Laden. Right.

Kit Heintzman 01:13:22
Bringing it back to the question about self care. What I think I'm hearing is that there have been very few paths for you to take in terms of taking care of yourself throughout this experience, that it's very upsetting that your capacity to go for walks is something that was positive for you in the past has become harder for you.

Vera Sharav 01:13:46
No, it's not harder. It's the atmosphere. It's the atmosphere. I mean, I can you know, when a friend comes out of friend over from Connecticut, and we took a walk and all that No, I, I can't it's but I'm, in other words, I'm not taking the time to do this for myself. On the other hand, on the other hand, I do wash my hair. I do you know, no, I do try. Mostly not to stay in me and I, you know, I mean, that's the sort of thing which is depressing when people start doing that. And people don't, you know, I mean, I think most people aren't simply you know, wearing sweats all day. That's it. We have a closet full of all of that is Yeah, I mean, it's take the joy is being taken out of life. That's what I really want to say without joy. There's no happiness, no, no sense of well being. And, I mean, I live and we both looped Lincoln Center for a reason. Hey, hold that music up. All that is really, part of me is very angry. Part of me is very angry. And I know that it's not healthy to be angry. But I can't tell. I can't understand why people aren't opening their eyes and their minds doing a little research to see whether, indeed, they have the power of the

Kit Heintzman 01:15:34
I'm at the. Please continue.

Vera Sharav 01:15:36
No, no, no, it's okay.

Kit Heintzman 01:15:39
So I met the last two questions. This is the penultimate one. You've brought up a number of studies that we're all sort of following in biomedical research, we all know biomedical research is happening. I'm wondering what you think people in the humanities and the social sciences could be studying now to help us understand this moment?

Vera Sharav 01:16:05
In the social sciences, well, yeah, the stuff times, it's just there to look at the forbidden, it may have some clues. Don't just look at the major journals, because in medicine, for example, the New England and the Lancet, JAMA, I mean, these are not we're independent scientists are publishing because they won't publish their work. They have to publish in. Second, third tier doesn't matter. The getting it out. And they're communicating with each other. And, of course, in the physical science, you know, physics, they haven't bothered with the published stuff for a long time they do. And they start immediately connecting with each other, communicating and sharing information, that it's faster. There's a real problem. And social scientists have also the problem that their faculties are not bringing in the kind of money that the medical and that makes a big difference. But you see, there's, there's a trade off. If they're not, then they shouldn't be held. To tight stringent. Thou shalt not look at that one's papers because he is okay, a renegade. Is should they really historians, and sociologists, and they need to look at a vast array.

Vera Sharav 01:18:05
I found a quote, I said in an interview, that, you know, a bunch of individuals make up the trade. And as a sign, a Nobel Laureate in medicine, let's face it, she said, a bunch, anecdotes make up statistics. That's evidence. Empirical evidence, which means real life things not statistical is what social scientists will not. I think that when they try to emulate, you know, do all the statistical things, they're missing the real picture, they should stay at the human level, then they can understand what I mean, one of the things and I don't know when that happened, but it did, where newspapers became very good source of primary information was, you know, there was a time that it was, you know, not regarded as right. No, everything is part of the patent. I think if social scientists understand that, yes, the center of the universe should be the human cause, then they won't make that mistake and be swept up into the tide of those tides do extreme damage. And we've had we've had many genocides in the 20th century.

Kit Heintzman 01:19:49
I'd like to move to my last question, which is, this has been an oral history interview. One of the assumptions I carry as a historian is that I I can't predict what a historian 50 100 200 years from now is going to value. And I'd like to give you the chance to tell them what you value and what kinds of histories, you want to be told about this moment.

Vera Sharav 01:20:24
I would want them to recognize that this was a fork in the road, where people individually and as a community, it's better to join groups to have some power to withstand this tsunami that we're having here, which is meant to sweep away. Life as we know it, in the Western world. Where we will, if we don't fight, if we're not willing to die. It will not be alive that any one of us would want children or grandchildren to be part of it's not worth it. Some some kind of living is not worth it.

Vera Sharav 01:21:29
It's really shocking that we are at this fork in the road, I never thought that it would happen. But I think that while they're trying to censor and silence, those who obviously they feel threatened by, why would they feel threatened about information? Because they're covering up cover up is really the reason that you keep hearing, conspiracy theory conspiracy. Hey, if there's a conspiracy theory, so what? So what 1984? Is it we would dozens of books write in great. Some, some profits, they're like the prophets of old recognize things in the air that most of us don't. They're the ones who wrote those books. They recognized where it was going. And it's extremely unnerving to have, you know, people in the United States and particularly, particularly the educated, the college educated, they are more blind to what is going on than the working class. Look. I can tell you from an exchange, you know, words with others, and everybody has the same time. Yep, the guy who comes the plumber the date, they get it. And it's the others who are so blinded. And then of course, we've got the the two parties at each other, but that's everywhere. Now. It's not only here. That's those are all distractions. distractions, because really, in this country, either party doesn't matter. The ones who call the shots, the only thing that changes is the size of the checks. The bribes go up if the if you're, you know, whichever one is in the Oval Office, that already all of them will get bigger checks than they are and then they switch if they switch. But it really it's not. It's not we who run things. They don't represent us. I certainly [inaudible]

Kit Heintzman 01:24:07
I want to thank you so much for taking this time to share your experiences and your worldview with me and to take this chance to ask you if there are if there's anything that you would like historians in the future anyone listening to this to know that I haven't given you the space to say yet.

Vera Sharav 01:24:26
I'll tell you an anecdote story. I told you that I was a child during the Holocaust. And I was three and a half were chased out of Romania and central concentration and my father died of typhus within half a year maybe In 1941, there was no 41 is wondering would chase down. Anyway, I was part of the group of orphans even though I wasn't a full orphan, but my mother lied to get out because they were about to annihilate whoever was left in the camp. This was a camp where we were left to starve, essentially, in the Ukraine. So I was essentially it was like, I don't know exactly who paid ransom. But that's what it was, I was being randsomed. And so, first, I went, in those cattle cars, the same ones that took people to the camps. And for, for almost a year, nine months, 10 months, I was sort of like, I didn't, until really recently, till maybe two or three years ago, I realized I was a foster kid for a while, I never thought of myself that way, you know, from one to the other to. Now, eventually, I was headed for Israel, where my mother had a sister. And I was little. And I never during those years, I never really trusted peers, you know, they bully and whatever. Yeah, I didn't, I always wanted to be with grownups. It was an only child. So anyway, on the train going to the harbor, we're boats, we're going to take us I befriended a [inaudible]. And we got to the port. There were three boats. And one boat was for the orphans, all the orphan children and I was supposed to go on there and I wouldnt I wouldn't no matter what everybody got on to where there were assigned. I was having, I was crying, screaming like that I remember very well. crying, crying, I would no matter what. Now today, you know, 86 that would have had me as oppositional defiance disorder. But I got away. And then went with the family. The a reporter who had done a profile on me and actually went to the Holocaust Museum, and he wound up seeing my name on two boats, because I was supposed to be a morning. Anyway, the first night out. I get very used to get very seasick I was, you know, I was never really on top. So I did not see it. But the boat with all the children was sunk [inaudible].

Vera Sharav 01:28:33
That experience you see, this was my defiance of authority. Now, I know now as an adult, that of course, it could have been the other way too, of course. But that's not the point. Of course, but I also took in I didn't I know that when they told me about. I didn't say anything at all. But I know I thought to myself, two things. You know, one is you have to fight. And I think that, that it I guess it's a symbol. It is symbolic of my character. And I wish people would understand that. There are choices in life. And when you have the chance to make a choice. You make the choice. And sometimes you'll be wrong. But it's your life. What goes into your body what you should be able to decide that not government's. You shouldn't give I mean, it's like giving your soul away. It's very same thing your bodies your soul I mean, it's your one person.

Vera Sharav 01:30:05
And I think that if more people would just take the chance of of living as free people would be so much better. We wouldn't then allow these bullies to push us around and that's something that one needs to community and irony of ironies that it was only learned very recently, it wasn't even a Nazi submarine. It was a Soviet How about that? All my life I thought it was [inaudible], as I said sometimes history doesn't tell the truth for a very long

Kit Heintzman 01:31:02
I want to thank you so much for the time that you've taken to be here with me today for the vulnerability and honesty of your answers. And just to say that I really appreciate this.

Vera Sharav 01:31:15
I would appreciate it if you somewhere other put, you know, a website so that people can see my work, you know, okay. And then thank you